Their Eyes Were Watching God is full of vibrant characters. Who are they and why are they important in the world of the novel? Also to consider: How do Janie's relationships with Logan Killicks, Jody Starks, and "Tea Cake" complicate and help to resolve the novel’s plot?
Janie Starks
ReplyDeleteJanie is the main character of the book. She is strong and persevering, and always keeps her head held high, even though she has been through a lot of suffering. She is romantic, sympathetic, and good natured, as well as being pretty and in strong (both physically and emotionally). She hasn't gotten a very good education, but she is still smart and has a touch of philosophy in her outlook of the world. She is christian. In the book, she is compared to a pear tree, bearing the fruit of labor, suffering, romance, and everything else that shapes her life and personality. She is driven by love and and the want of living her life to its fullest.
She has suffered all her life, yet she refuses to become sullen and unhappy, and looks upon life with determination and a small smile. When she was a kid, she was teased because she lived with white people, because she was African American and this was just after the civil war, when discrimination between races was prominent in the South (this takes place in Florida). She was raised by her grandmother, her mentor, because her mother became alcoholic and disappeared after Janie was born because of the trauma it gave her to be raped (this was how Janie was conceived) at 17). This is just the beginning of her hard life, which includes three marriages. But she always kept her chin in the air and refuses to live in sorrow or a false ideal of what the world is.
Janie’s relationship with Tea Cake changes her from an “average” house maker to an outgoing woman with a spirit of excitement. Janie previously experiences relationships with people who are very cruel to her because they are men who live in the time period, meaning that men make a living while women deal with the house and a possible family. Even though the African American men have lived through an extensively long period of enslavement, they still treat women as second-class; the men being the first class. Janie feels irritated and eventually succumbs to Joe’s harsh treatment of her; Joe wants her to stay out of any business but work. After Joe’s death, when Janie is introduced to Tea Cake, she feels as if she can have a strong and at the same time fun relationship. Eventually, Janie feels confident enough that she goes to work in the field with Tea Cake: “So the next morning Janie got ready to pick beans along with Tea Cake” (133). Janie would not have even believed in herself before she met Tea Cake. Since Tea Cake is kind to her and encourages her to be happy and do what she like to, Janie can finally be herself.
ReplyDeleteNanny:
ReplyDeleteNanny, Janie's grandmother, describes herself as a "cracked plate" (20). She has lived a very difficult life: she gives birth to her slave owner's daughter, Janie's mother, around September 1864 (end of Sherman's Atlanta Campaign, the reason why the men all leave to help the southern war effort). Threatened by a vicious beating by the slave owner's wife, Nanny flees the plantation and hides in the woods until the end of the Civil War. She raises her child without a father, putting her in school as soon as there is one available. But Janie's mother is raped by the school teacher at age 17, and leaves Nanny to take care of her child, Janie. She gets a second chance with Janie, and so she does everything she can, sacrificing it all, so that Janie can stay on her highway.
Even though Nanny does everything she can to take care of Janie, she jump-starts Janie's sequence of marriages. When she sees Janie kissing Johnny Taylor, she insists that Janie get married right away, to a man who can protect Janie when she is gone. This is not necessarily a bad thing, but it does complicate Janie's life. But, most importantly, Nanny was Janie's caregiver, and she made a highway for Janie to follow to a happier life than her's. "'Ah been waitin' a long time, Janie, but nothin' Ah been through ain't too much if you just a stand on high ground lak Ah dreamed.'" (16)
From the very start of the novel, it is apparent that Janie Crawford leads a life full of obstacles and hardships. Growing up, she deals with events that most would never dream of facing even as an adult. Being married off at a ridiculously young age to a man whom she has never had much of a chance to meet by the force of her ailing grandmother, Janie grows up a whole lot faster than she should.
ReplyDeleteLogan Killicks, an apparently semi-wealthy man in Janie's town, takes the role of her first husband. At this point, Janie is inexperienced as a house wife, as she is only in her adolescent years! Even though Logan shows Janie a sense of security by being a stable part of her life, just like any other young girl, she comes to realizations about reality. The act of marriage is something that should be shared between two people who love each other. It brings two people together, & those two people pledge to love each other unconditionally. Janie learns that marriage does not equal automatic love. Just like any young women, her fairy tail dreams begin to vanish, & Logan shows her that she must face reality on her own.
Eventually, Janie grows tired of the sullen life she leads with her husband. She meets a young man named Joe Starks. He shows Janie that marriage can be full of excitement and fulfillment, instead of a boring, repeating life style. Joe snatched Janie from Logan, and she continues on to a new life, which is her choosing. Janie learns to make her own choices, and be a bit more of her own person.
Janie illustrates that she is not ready to responsibly marry someone by her transition from one marriage to another in pages 27 through 33. At first Janie had allowed herself to engage in a loveless marriage thinking that her passion for the man would suddenly kick in once they were married. Of course, that not being the case, she and her husband quarreled and argued often over chores and whether or not Janie should work in the field. Therefore, when an unusual man named Joe showed up at their doorstep, and sympathized with Janie her interest sparked. They socialized and sweet-talked for only one week when Joe said, “Janie if you think Ah aims to tole you off and make a dog outa you, youse wrong. Ah wants to make a wife outa you” (page 29). Being in such a stressful, premature relationship at the age of 16 or so, Janie quickly decided to run off. Without looking back Janie skipped down the road from one undesirable marriage and directly into another. Although Joe had seemed as though he was only going to think about Janie’s best interest, he put his dreams of greatness over hers and forced her to work in a store and post office while he governed the town. Also, Joe forced Jane to tie her hair up, and did not allow her to engage in conversation with men, in order to prevent them from finding her attractive. Although Janie’s first marriage was different from the second, both her husband’s eventually dictated over her life one way or another. I believe that the fact that she so quickly jumped from one undesirable marriage to another shows she was unprepared for that type of relationship, and in order to grow as a character in this novel she will need to break away from the culture of male dominant relationships.
ReplyDeleteLogan Killicks
ReplyDeleteLogan was Janie's first husband, their marriage was semi-arranged by Nanny. Janie's first impression of Logan is that he "look like some ole skullhead". After Janie finds out that marriage does not make love, Logan loses interest in Janie as a person and wants her to do work. He claims that Janie has been spoiled because she has never worked before. After Janie met Joe Starks, Janie threatened Logan that she might leave him. when Logan asked Janie to help him with his work, Janie kept her word and left him.
In Chapter 5, Joe Starks arrives at Eatonville, where he becomes, more or less the focus of the story. Although he wants to help the community, the relationship Joe has with the people becomes illustrated in a way that I found somewhat unexpected. “The town had a basketful of feelings good and bad about Joe’s positions and possessions...the town bowed down” (50). Although Joe Starks has worked for others for all of his life he does not hesitate to control the people in the town, as he essentially destroys the freedom that the society once had before he arrived. The people fulfill the tasks that Joe asks of them not out of respect, but out of fear. In this situation, the community realizes how much uncontrollable power that he has over them because “none had the temerity to challenge him” (50). The tone of the passage suggests that Joe’s strength resembles that of slavery because the community is told to obey his commands and because they are afraid to go against his orders, although they are the ones who gave him such authority. Despite the mixed feelings the town has about Joe’s “positions and possessions” (50), his strength leaves the others to be influenced by his control. I think that Joe’s obsession of having discipline over others is a response to when he was told what to do by his previous masters. He wants to become a powerful leader for the people so that he will gain pride and respect from his community, from Janie, and for himself.
ReplyDeleteHey everyone, I’m hoping to initiate a discussion about Pheoby Watson. Each of the anecdotes in Their Eyes Were Watching God is delivered to the reader as a story that Janie is telling her friend Pheoby. This structure provides a very intimate setting for story telling, and because Janie trusts Pheoby, it seems as if very little is being hidden from the reader or left out of Janie’s story.
ReplyDeleteHowever, Pheoby’s character provides more than a sense of intimacy between Janie and the reader. Pheoby is able to serve as a bridge between Janie and her heritage, and the culture that she seems to have left behind in her adventures outside of West Florida.
When Janie first comes home, the women gawk at her, and after she leaves they begin to gossip about her, and Pheoby is the first to defend her, and even has clear intentions of hospitality, stating, “ Ah’m bound to go take her some supper” (3). Pheoby accepts Janie’s clear dissimilarity to anyone else in the community. At the same time, Pheoby is clearly defined as a part of the culture and even says, “ Ah hears what they say ‘cause they just will collect round mah porch” (5).
Essentially, Pheoby’s role in the novel is more than just serving as a friend to Janie. She also serves as an important intermediary between Janie and the older and more traditional generation of women in the community.
Tea Cake is usually a very sweet hearted character when it comes to his relationship with the general public. However, late in Zora Neale Hurston’s novel, Their Eyes Were Watching God, Tea Cake suddenly contains a strong hatred for Mrs. Turner. Mrs. Turner is a woman filled with hatred and disrespect for others. She especially hates herself and all other people who and dark-skinned for both how they look and how they act. Tea Cake ignores this aspect about her, but hates her when he alleges to Janie that when Mrs. Turner talks to her, Mrs. Turner is trying to separate Janie and Tea Cake. He tells Janie, “Ah been heah uh long time listenin’ to dat heifer run me down tuh de dawgs uh try tuh tole you off from me” (143). Tea Cake becomes enraged that Mrs. Turner would try to divorce them, because he is truly in love with Janie. He tells Janie to only talk disrespectfully to Mrs. Turner: “All you can do is treat her cold whenever she come round here” (144). Tea Cake’s disrespect for Mrs. Turner is prompted by his love for and closeness with Janie.
ReplyDeleteAs a reader, I find Janie one of the most interesting characters in this novel so far. One of the many reasons that I find her interesting is the fact that she pursues her dreams no matter what. Although many of her dreams do not come true, she still looks for her true love. For instance, when she realized that her marriage did not bring her love, she did not give up but rather keep her head up and keep looking. This scene is described in this passage: “The familiar people and things had failed her so she hung over the gate and looked up the road towards way off. She knew now that marriage did not make love. Janie’s first dream was dead, so she became a women”(25). We also learn in this passage that she has changed herself in order to find love. She has become “a women”, no longer a girl with childish dreams and expectations. In addition, her characterstics also foreshadow that she will have similar problems with other men in the future as well.
ReplyDeleteOne of the main themes in Zora Neale Hurston’s novel, Their Eyes Were Watching God, is how people judge one another by their appearance and not by who they really are. Janie, the heroine of the novel, is a good example of this because she is constantly being judged by people’s perception of her beauty only.
ReplyDeleteJanie’s mother, Leafy, was mulatto, therefore Janie was born with light skin. Janie’s hair is long and straight. These features seem to cast her apart from the other people which causes them to treat her differently and this makes her feel lonely . Because of the way she looks, the character of Joe Starks tells Janie that she is too pretty to do the farm work that her first husband, Logan Killicks, makes her do. He tells her:
"You behind a plow! You ain’t got no mo’ business wid uh plow than uh hog is got wid uh holiday! You ain’t got no business cuttin’ up no seed p’taters neither. A pretty doll-baby lak you is made to sit on de front porch and rock and fan yo’self and eat p’taters dat other folks plant just special for you." (p. 29.)
This speech of Starks may seem flattering, but it is in a way discriminatory to Janie by suggesting that just because she looks a certain way, she is weak or different from other people. Later in the story, Joe Starks forces Janie to wear her hair bound in cloth while she works in his store. He forces her to do this because he is worried that someone will fall in love with her because of her hair and run away with her as he did when he and Janie ran away from her first husband, Logan Killicks. I believe that when Starks makes her do this, it is a symbol of how her appearance imprisons her.
There are many examples of how Janie’s beauty causes her unhappiness. Janie’s grandmother believes Janie is lucky to have been chosen by Logan Killicks, who has land and can offer her protection. But she doesn’t love him and he doesn’t make her happy. Then her second husband, Joe Starks, treats Janie more as a possession than a person because of her beauty. Luckily, Janie finally finds true happiness when she marries Tea Cake, who loves her for who she is and not because of what she looks like.
(Riley Winograd)
In Zora Neal Hurston’s Their Eye’s were Watching God the character Nanny plays a brief, but pivotal role in kick starting the main plot of the story. Haunted by the trauma and disappointment of her past Nanny uses her parental power over her granddaughter Janie to influence her into marrying a man who will provide for her, regardless of a lack of love on Janie’s part. This marriage eventually ends as a complete failure, but spurs Janie to elope with Joe Starks, and leading to the main events of the novel. Nanny’s decision to marry Janie to Logan stems from her broken dreams and her idea of what Janie’s dreams and life should be. Nanny tells Janie, “Ah didn’t want to be used for a work-ox and a brood-sow and Ah didn’t want mah daughter used that way neither… Ah wanted to preach a great sermon about colored women sittin’ on high, but they wasn’t no pulpit for me” (16). All of the things Nanny wanted in life, to live comfortably and to speak out for the rights of black women were trampled. Nanny’s life was instead stricken by tragedy: not only was she raped and impregnated by her owner, but she also saw the same thing happen to her own daughter, and as a result was left with Janie. Through all of this hardship Nanny comes to the conclusion not only that “De nigger woman is de mule uh de world,” but also that she must also keep this from being true with Janie (14). Nanny’s own experiences encourage her to take control of Janie’s future. By initiating the marriage between Janie and Logan she attempts to force her own dreams of stability onto Janie. However despite her benevolent intentions, Nanny fails to recognize that because of Janie’s comfortable upbringing Janie’s dreams are quite different and more romantic than hers.
ReplyDeleteNanny:
ReplyDeleteUp to the point that I have read in the book Their Eyes Were Watching God Nanny is the character that I find the most interesting. Nanny has always been a dreamer who has aspired to make a difference. For example: “ah wanted to preach a great sermon about colored woman sittin’ on high but they wasn’t no pulpit for me.” (16) All her life Nanny’s ambitious dreams have been held back by slavery and racism, as a result she wants to give the next generations a foundation so they may be able to achieve their own dreams. Nanny realizes that her people were, “branches without roots” (16) meaning, African Americans have no foundation on which to build their lives upon because of slavery. But Nanny has suffered many hardships. For one, her daughter was raped at the young age of sixteen, which completely changed her life and caused her to become reckless and run away. So at the end of Nanny’s life she wants desperately for her grandchild, Janie, to marry and be happy but Janie seems to have too much of her mother in her.
Joe Starks is an interesting character because of the initial vibrancy of his life. He shows himself to be the first character that truly grabs hold of his dreams and makes them come true, when his hope of becoming a man of power is fulfilled by his becoming the mayor of Eatonville. He had a drive about him and a strong personality, but though originally her savior, he ultimately became a warning for Janie, an example of what could happen if somewhere along the way the dream is lost. On his sick bed, Janie tells him, “Jody, you ain’t de Jody ah run off down de road wid. You’se whut’s left after he died” (86). She was there, watching his deterioration as slowly he became too satisfied with himself and forgot what was really important, and so in the future Janie has more of a hope of being continually successful in her dream, whatever that may be.
ReplyDelete*I am no where near to finished on the book so excuse anything i might say that sounds wrong*
ReplyDeleteJody Starks first appears in the novel as a friend to Janie but later develops to be Janie's husband and the Mayor of Eatonville. Starks is shown as a very compelling, smart character and runs off with Janie, filling her sense of adventure and the role as "the perfect man" to be with at the beginning of the novel. Later as she is the wife to Starks when he is the Mayor she finds her life too complicated and would rather live without the pressures of being someone of such high nature. A possible reason for Janie's discomfort with her place in power might be because when she married Starks he wasn't a figure of strength, and now that he is he can't be the same man that he used to to his wife: "it jus' looks lak it keeps us in some way we ain't natural wid one 'nother. You'se always off talkin' and fixin' things' and Ah feels lak Ah'm jus' markin' time. Hope it soon gits over" (46). Janie expresses her discomfort to Starks be explaining that she doesn't like how it has changed their relationship.
Okay, sorry again about the posting multiple times and then deleting them. This the last time I do that.
ReplyDeleteTo what Colin R posted about Logan Killicks:
“ . . . After Janie finds out that marriage does not make love, Logan loses interest in Janie as a person and wants her to do work.”
This makes it sound like he treated her as a maid or employee once she got some sense on her shoulders. But we know he respected her more than that, and he did not lose faith in her as quickly as she did in him. She describes to Nanny: “ he ain't even talked 'bout hittin' me. He says he ain't never mean to lay a hand on me in malice. He chops all de wood he thinks Ah wants and den he totes it in the kitchen for me. Keeps both water buckets full” (22-23). He still treats her like a woman, I believe it is more like he just needs more help on the farm. Logan says, “Ah needs two mules dis yeah. . . Ah aims to run two plows. . . “(27). Extra works means more hands and more money. It is hard enough to run a farm on your own, and now with Janie, he is not only supporting himself anymore. I also feel like it was incredibly naïve of Janie to believe that once one is married, love automatically follows. Either she is extremely self-centered, or completely sheltered. Maybe Logan was discouraged by Janie herself, since he did not interest her in the first place.
-- Aleia
Hi, my name is Lev. I'm only a few chapters into the book, but I have noticed something about the main character, Janie. She seems conflicted by the intersection of love and the idea of becoming a woman. She thinks quite a bit about marriage, and love, and even in her day dreams she sees connections between love and nature. For example: "She stretched on her back beneath the pear tree.....she saw a dust bearing bee sink into the sanctum of a bloom; the thousand sister-calyxes arch to meet the love embrace and the ecstatic of tree from root to root to tiniest branch creaming in every blossom and frothing with delight. So this was marriage!" (P. 11). She constantly seems like she is longing for love, and manages to see it everywhere. Janie even goes as far as kissing a boy who the author describes as quite undesirable. But when her grandmother, Nanny catches her kissing him and tells her that she is becoming a woman, Janie hears says that she is still a girl. She seems like she wants to become a woman, and find love, but she doesn’t like what womanhood entails. Overall Janie seems caught between childhood needs and adult-like fantasies of love.
ReplyDeleteI have a question about Nanny. I cannot find a clear description of her, but I have been wondering why she thought she was a white child. It would sort of make sense if she was light skinned, yet why was she so surprised to find out she wasn't? Couldn't she tell by looking at her arm what her skin color was? I doubt she has never seen her reflection in water or glass. Especially when interacting with white children she should have noticed a difference. And if she was related to a black woman she should look similar, no? It may be symbolic, but it's still pretty . . . illogical.
ReplyDelete--Aleia
Aleia,
ReplyDeleteI thought that was very strange too! While it helps get a perspective on how comfortable Janie was with herself within her white family and how everyone treated one another, it doesn't really seem possible to me that someone can be unaware of their physical appearance! I agree with your point on how it would seem that she would come to some sort of realization when interacting with white children outside of her family considering the time period and the racial inequality. As you said, it might be symbolic which would make a little more sense as it would give insight on how she feels. However, I too found it strange when reading it as the way it is written does not really insinuate it to be symbolic, especially when her family jokes with her when she is surprised by her photo. To me, it would make a little more sense if Janie's realization was her learning that it was rare for such relationships to exist between whites and blacks.
One very important character is Tea Cake. Tea Cake is the husband who Janie loved the most. Logan Killicks, her first husband, loved her and treated her well, but she did not love him back. Joe Starks, her second husband, interests and excites Janie with the idea of running away and founding an all-black town. All the fun and excitement leaves though, when he founds the town but makes her run the store day in and day out. When Tea Cake comes along, he doesn't have much in the way of money or possessions. He does however have a fun personality that appeals to Janie and allows her to really love him. He seems to always be "throwing grins over his shoulder" (which I think means looking over his shoulder and smiling at Janie or someone else), he plays the guitar, and he's an expert at dice. To me, he seems like a very sociable person that just about everybody likes to be around. Later in the book, however, he becomes more possessive of Janie because he's scared of losing her. He also shows this a little earlier in the book when they're in Eatonville, and Janie says that she's just a friend: "Janie walked towards the staircase slowly, and Tea Cake sat where he was, as if frozen to his seat, in fear that once he got up, he'd never get back in again." He simply doesn't want her to leave him.
ReplyDeleteI find that Janie's second marriage with Joe Starks varies a lot from her first marriage with Logan Killicks due to it being more complicated. First off, since Jainie chose to marry Jody while leaving Logan behind because she felt she truly loved Jody, their marriage seems to be much more passionate. At first, Jody promises many things to Jainie and tells her, “A pretty doll-baby lak you is made to sit on de front porch and rock and fan yo’self…” (p29). As Jainie dreams of the future with Jody as he appears to be very loving and considerate, they immediately rush off to get married. However, once they arrive at Eatonville, Jody’s character gradually becomes more and more self-interested as well as demanding and condescending towards the other citizens and Jainie.
ReplyDeleteAs they had not spent much time together before their marriage and hurried into it, Jainie is shocked when Jody is controllable over her for one of the first times. When the town encourages her to give a speech as she is the wife of the mayor, Jody instantly says that she does not know anything about giving speeches and that that is not the reason that he married her. Although Jainie had never given a speech before, the narrator states that, “It must have been the way Joe spoke out without giving her a chance to say anything one way or another that took the bloom off things. But anyway, she went down the road behind him that night feeling cold. He strode along invested with his new dignity, thought and planned out loud, unconscious of her thoughts” (p43). Jainie seems confused as Jody’s first impression on her strongly contrasts his later actions while he develops more of an ego and becomes less concerned about her feelings.
Aleia,
ReplyDeleteIt seems like the author meant to show the reader that before Janie saw the picture, she felt she actually was white. "Den dey all laughed real hard. But before Ah seen de picture Ah thought Ah wuz just like de rest." (9) I noticed that Janie, in her retelling, goes on to say that shortly after that, in school, she begins to be teased by a girl named Mayrella. "Mis' Washburn useter dress me up in all de clothes her gran'chillun didn't need no mo' which wuz better'n whut de rest uh de colored chillun had."(9) So essentially, she is treated by the African-American children at school as a spoiled "white" child. To Janie, this coexistence with white people is perfectly normal, but she comes to learn that it was not at the time. That entire section was, I noticed, the only instance white people were talked about in any great detail, which I found perfectly agreeable. In any case, the revelation seems slightly symbolic in that it's a rather large turning point in the book, as Janie is thrust into the "real world". "Us lived dere havin' fun till de chillun at the school got to teasin' me 'bout livin' in de white folks' back-yard."(9) So she begins to grow up and the book goes on.
Quinn--
ReplyDeleteWell, feeling white or acting white is very different from actually being white. Though I see and appreciate your point. Hurston portrayed Nanny as being "blind" to her own skin color, as well as the difference between classes/races.
But without the symbolism, my point still stands, haha. I guess we'll just have to give Nanny the benefit of the doubt.
--Aleia
Hello again all. This blog will be about a week early, due to me leaving to the land of no internet until past the due date. I have found that Janie goes through a couple of major development points in this novel. The first would be her realizations watching the pear tree and the bees, then kissing Johnny Taylor, because she wanted her own "singing bees"(11). This sets off her marriage to Logan Killicks, which, while she protests against his age compared to hers, she goes along with, but still waiting for the love she has been promised to develop. The next major change comes when she realizes that love won't develop just because she is married, and she becomes dissatisfied, which spurns her to run off with the nice gentleman who she met while he was walking past her home. She describes Joe Starks as "a cityfied, stylish dressed man with his hat set at an angle that didn't be long in these parts"(27) His style and mannerisms knock Janie off her feet, and so off they go, and they get married. The next major change doesn't happen so immediately, instead, it happened over a long period of years, where Janie realizes that Joe isn't the man she fell for and ran off with, and becomes more and more withdrawn, coming to almost resent him and the rules and insult laid on her, and on women in general. She finally accepts this change when she stands up to Joe in the store, and accuses him and his manhood. This change puts a major strain on their relationship, until Joe's death a few weeks later. With his death she was able to be who she wanted. This change came about during the finalities of his funeral. "The funeral was going on outside. All things concerning death and burial were said and done. Finish. End. Nevermore. Darkness. Deep hole. Dissolution. Eternity. Weeping and wailing outside. Inside the expensive black folds were resurrection and life. She did not reach outside for anything, nor did the things of death reach inside to disturb her calm. She sent her face to Joe's funeral, and herself went rollicking with springtime across the world"(88). This shows Janie finally moving on by herself, and not depending on others to show her how her life should be run. She has become whole by herself, and this allows her to be calm within herself. This change has allowed her to more fully understand herself, and live life as she wants to. This is the point to which I have reached in the book, and any other changes that come at a later date may change the fact that she's very independent at the moment.
ReplyDeleteSo far in the book I think Janie is defined by her relationships with other people. Her first relationship is with her grandma. Her grandma was born a slave and after the civil war, she lived as a servant in someone’s backyard. Janie’s grandma valued land and money. She wanted Janie to have security after she died so she encouraged her marry to Logan Killicks.
ReplyDelete“Tain’t Logan Killicks Ah wants you to have, baby, it’s protection. “ page 15
Janie married Logan Killicks was when she was 16 years old. She thought she might fall in love with him, but she never does. She always refers to him as Mr. Killicks, indicating that they are not equals in the marriage. Two months into their marriage she goes to talk with her Nanny and tries to explain her feelings about her marriage.
“Ah could throw ten acres of (the land) over the fence every day and never look back to see where it fell. Ah feel the same way ‘bout Mr. Killicks too. Some folks was never meant to be loved and he’s one of ‘em.” page 23
In Zora Neale Hurston’s novel, There Eyes Were Watching God, there is a poorly treated mule who lives with a mean man named Matt Bonner. The mule isn’t fed enough and then is forced to plow fields. Since the mule is so badly treated he is skittish and ornery.
ReplyDeleteOne day the mule runs away from Matt Bonner and ends up in front of Joe Starke’s store. Joe is the husband of Janie, the heroine of the story. The men who sit and chat on the porch of the store start taunting and teasing the mule. Janie mumbles to herself how cruel they are being and that they should be ashamed of themselves. She says:
"They oughta be shamed uh theyselves! Teasin’ dat poor brute beast lak they is! Done been worked tuh death; done had his disposition ruint wid mistreatment, and now they got tuh finish devilin’ ‘im tuh death. Wisht ah had mah way wid’ em ali." (Page 56)
Joe hears her and on a sudden act of kindness for Janie, buys the mule from the evil Matt Bonner (page 58.)He fattens the mule up and the mule has a nice happy life till he eventually dies of old age (page 59.) The citizens of Eatonville where they all live have a funeral for the mule.
Later in the story Joe starts treating Janie very poorly. I believe that the mule is a short flash of Janie’s life with Joe. Joe bought the mule from Matt Bonner, who represents to be Janie’s first husband, Logan Killicks, with whom she was unhappy. Janie is the mule who was “bought” by Joe. But when the mule dies, that symbolizes her happiness with Joe dying.
(Riley Winograd)
Logan Killicks
ReplyDeleteWhen Janie is pressured into marrying Logan it is immediately clear he is not the man to fulfill her romantic dreams of a sweet marriage. Even if Logan is not Janie's marital dreams come to life, he treats her well, does not hit her, and helps with chopping wood and carrying water. He is a good man and I find it sad that Janie does not realize this. I think Logan is a very necessary character to Janie's development as a young woman learning about the world. Their marriage teaches her a very important lesson about love and marriage that starts Janie on her path to becoming the proud, resilient woman she is at the end of the book. This quote on page 25 shows the importance of Logan and Janie's marriage, “She knew now that marriage did not make love. Janie's first dream was dead, so she became a woman.” Logan acts as a gateway to the rest of Janie's life.
In Their Eyes Were Watching God, a character, Tea Cake is Janie’s third husband. Although he is an adventurous and exciting person he really was not the right man for Janie to marry. However, after living a non-loving and controlled life with Joe Starks for 17 years, the thought of living with the free-spirited, theatrical Tea Cake must have seemed like a potential jump in a lake after a long desert hike. However, Tea Cake’s free spirit made him unpredictable and not always trustworthy. For example on page 118 Tea Cake stole $200 of Janie’s money and disappeared for a day and a half, then returned with wild stories of his adventure and a few remaining bucks. He then promised Janie he would get the money back by gambling off his payday check. Also, Tea Cake often jumps from job to job and is frequently unemployed. Janie needs a man who is trustworthy and rational, yet spontaneous and adventurous. Honestly, Tea Cake is not that man. He lives solely in the moment and does not think of the impacts of his actions. Janie’s previous two relationships were not with “the right man” either. Those men mainly thought of the future and were not adventurous and stuck to their daily routine. Tea Cake, on the other hand, is far from ever following a routine or schedule, and is on the opposite side of the spectrum as Janie’s previous husbands. I think Janie needs to find someone in between, or simply give up on men.
ReplyDeleteThere was one passage that really struck me it was near the middle of the book a little after Joe dies "When god made man...show her shine." (P.90) At first this passage stood out to me because I thought it was really beautiful and interesting, but when I thought about it a little more I noticed that it was a great description of Janie's character. Like the sparks (or humans) although people (like the jealous angels) often try to bring Janie's spirits down and stop her from being the happy person she is, her "spark" cant be dimmed or covered. Multiple people through out the story try to keep her down, starting with her grandmother who although had the best wishes for Janie tried to control her life. Joe gets jealous and yells at her and tries to make her seem older than she is to put attention off his own age, and he has her tie her hair up so that other men don't get to enjoy it. The townsfolk who sit on the porch of the store, gossip about her and say lost of mean things. but through all of this Janie's character stays strong and bright. This is interesting because in the story about the sparks and angels, the angels eventually do cover the humans so that they don't shine through. Maybe this is foreshadowing that someday events in her life make her give up and stop shining.
ReplyDeleteJoe Starks is a man with status. If it weren’t for his status he would be a smart, charming jerk. Joe’s charm and intelligence lures Janie into coming along on his adventures. In the beginning Joe treats Janie nicely. He buys her nice things and he cares for her. He takes her to live in an all black town. When he sees that this town is only a few houses and a few acres of land, Joe’s ambition causes him to build a store, and a post office. He also creates roads and expands the town. Because Joe helped the town survive, the people of the town elect him mayor. He makes Janie work at his post office and store and he treats Janie like a slave. When she messes up he hits her and/or insults. Joe thinks poorly of woman. He thinks a man needs to give a woman guidance because he doesn’t believe women are capable of thought. He won’t let Janie talk with the men, and when she tries he tells her to shut up. When Janie finally is fed up with Joe and insults him in front of the men in town, it shows that Joe fears being laughed at, especially when a woman outsmarts him. Joe knows Janie is smarter than him and he oppresses her because he knows she can outsmart him and he wants to prevent that. He wants to remain a leader and he tries to prevent Janie from getting in his way.
ReplyDeleteJoe Starks holds power over people. He is charismatic and ambitious, and these qualities allow him to fix the town, and control it. Because he built the town, he has a huge amount of power over it, and he generates more. By living in a house much grander then the rest, he creates a sense of separation from everyone else, he rules over them, he is not one of them. And they come to resent him for this.
ReplyDeleteAs to his relationship with Janie, it is rather like with the people of the town; he wins her with ambition and gifts and promises of a better life, and then he owns her. Joe believes that he should have complete control over Janie, so he creates the role of "Mayor's Wife". The mayor's wife must not do certain things, because it would not be proper, and she must do certain things. This is how he controls her at first. Joe also forces her to work for him, in the post office and the store, which she despises.
Janie is a social person, and Joe tries to keep her only for himself. He keeps her from talking to other men, and from generally joining her community. I think this is because Joe Starks likes to own things, and he feels he should own her, as he practically owns the town. Joe wants Janie to belong to him, and only him, to do what he says and not look at another man or disobey. He takes this to the extreme at treats Janie like a slave. Joe Starks is about power, and he wants power over every thing in his life.
Personally for me a character that could hold my interest was Joe Starks, Janie’s second husband. He immediately dazzles her with his arrival. Nice clothes, polite, he wants to be somebody. He lures her away with the promise of a new life where she will have everything she desires. “De day you put yo’ hand in mine, Ah wouldn’t let de sun go down on us single. Ah’m a man wid principles. You ain’t never knowed what it was to be treated lak a lady and Ah wants to be de one tuh show yuh”(pg 29) Janie seemed so desperate to get away from Logan Killicks and everything that Joe said sounded perfect.
ReplyDeleteBut soon after he and Janie run away together Joe becomes the mayor of a small town. His promises turn to dust as power goes to his head. He’s rude and obnoxious to his wife and insanely jealous that another man will steal her away. He acts of upper class and looks down at the towns people. But none of them will stand up to Joe because he is a mystery to all of them. He’s civilized and seems to know what he’s doing. “The town had a basketful of feelings good and bad about Joe’s positions and possessions, but none had the temerity to challenge him. The bowed down to him rather, because he was all of these things, and then again he was all of these things because the town bowed down.”(pg 50) It took me a moment to understand the quote but then it makes perfect sense. It’s all just a circle. He wouldn’t be what he is without the people looking up to him, which is why he’s so respected.
The infuriating thing is he’s one of those people who just won’t admit they’re wrong. When his wife finally stands up to him he acknowledges it with a slap in the face. And when he dies it is not at peace. It’s with anger that he leaves. I think that maybe at first Joe Starks did have good intentions. And I believe that he did care for Janie throughout his life. But in the end he cared for her more as a possession then a person he loved. Why I found Joe to be such an interesting character is because he was a very realistic portrayal of humans. Even with a good heart when too much power comes at once even the best people can go wrong.
"This makes it sound like he treated her as a maid or employee once she got some sense on her shoulders. But we know he respected her more than that, and he did not lose faith in her as quickly as she did in him".
ReplyDeleteYou do have a point here, my statement that Logan lost interest in Janie as a person is somewhat incorrect, and I do agree that Janie had very naïve beliefs on marriage. I think that as you say, Janie lost interest in her marriage. Janie left Logan because she found out what a loveless marriage is like, and he asked her to help him with farm work, something she had no interest in or experience with. so, in a sense, both Janie and Logan brought about the end of their marriage.
Janie and Nanny have an extremely intimate and caring relationship with each other because of how much Nanny wants the best for Janie and how Janie trusts Nanny completely. The reason Nanny cares so much is because of the hardships she and her child went through due to slavery and segregation. She was never given much freedom or choices and unconsciously thought of herself as just a slave: “Ah don’t know nothin’ but what Ah’m told tuh do, ‘cause Ah ain’t nothin’ but uh nigger and uh slave” (17) When the civil war ended, she wanted to make sure that future generations don’t have to go through the same terrible hardships. This is why she reacted so harshly when she saw Janie kissing Johnny Taylor. To Janie, it wasn’t very significant, but to Nanny, it looked like Janie was going to waste her future even though she could do much better. In her eyes, she thought Janie would be happier with a respectable person like Logan rather than a “trashy nigger, no breath-and-britches” (13)
ReplyDeleteJanie also went against her better judgment and convinced herself that marrying Logan was the right choice to make. She mostly did this for Nanny’s sake and didn’t marry out of love but instead married for Nanny’s happiness.
Hey everybody,
ReplyDeleteI wanted to talk about Janie’s early views of marriage and her expectations of love and marriage. So far, Janie has left Logan for Joe and is now living with Joe, but when Janie is about to be married to Logan, she wonders if she will love him after they are married. She thinks, “Husbands and wives always loved each other, and that was what marriage meant” (21). After they are married, she goes upstairs in their house and “waits for love to begin” (22). She has an almost childish and a wishful view of marriage and love. When she is married a while to Logan she discovers that contrary to her beliefs, a couple who is married doesn’t always love each other and love doesn’t just ‘begin.’ The last line of chapter three is: “She knew now that a marriage did not make love. Janie’s first dream was dead, so she became a woman” (25). Her experiences cause her to find that what she believed before is completely false and therefore causes her to have a slightly pessimistic view on her relationships.
So this is what I think about Joe Starks in chapters four and five.
ReplyDeleteIn chapter four, I thought he was a bit of an ambitious dreamer because he wanted to be a big voice in an unfamiliar town. He seemed like he had everything planned out, like how children sometimes plan their future. They plan every step they need to take to go to a certain college or get a certain job.
“He whistled, mopped his face and walked like he knew where he was going. He was a seal-brown color but he acted like Mr. Washburn or somebody like that to Janie.” (27)
In that passage, I thought he sounded really confident despite the fact that he was a colored man.
In chapter five, my opinions changed, escepcially towards the end when Hicks was talking about his opinion of Starks.
“What Ah don’t lak ‘bout de man is, he talks tuh unlettered folks wid books n his jaws.” (49)
When I read Hick’s’ opinion, I thought Joe seemed arrogant because he spoke at a higher level than the rest of the town, including his own wife.
When I finished the chapter, I gathered that he respected Janie, but he only thought of her as a landmark on his path of success. He always asked for her help with running the shop or passing food out, but he never asked for her opinions, giving me the impression that he never thought of her as his equal.
In response to Jyoti's comment:
ReplyDeleteI have the same kind of perspective on Joe as well. In the beginning when he met with Janie I thought he was a gentlmen, a man of will,and someone who could understand her. My thoughts about him started to change when he became overwhelmed with building the town. Let alone thinking about her, he ordered her around to do work like a maid. I was obviously disappointed because I honestly thought that she would have found someone she can rely on but apparently that's not the case.
I know this isn't directly character related, but I wanted to bring up the relationship between Tea Cake and Janie. In the gender discussion, a lot has been said about Janie’s relationships with her first two husbands, but I feel not much has been said about Tea Cake and Janie as a pair.
ReplyDeleteWhat I love about their dynamic is that it's one of the first times we see Janie as her true, happy self. The aspect I like most about their relationship is how innocent and child-like it seems. There are so many passages that describe their giddiness to the point where it seems like such a puppy-love relationship. One passage in particular stood out to me: “It was so crazy digging worms by lamp light and setting out for Lake Sabelia after midnight that she felt like a child breaking rules. That’s what made Janie like it. They…got home just before day. Then she had to smuggle Tea Cake out by the back gate and that made it seem like some great secret she was keeping,” (page 102). Beyond their passion for each other, I love that they truly have fun together, something Janie didn’t have in her two previous marriages. I think because Janie got married pretty young, to a much older person, she didn’t really experience young love, and actually falling in love, and I think it’s a very refreshing thing to read about so late in the novel. It adds an overall lightness to her character after Janie has had to deal with a good amount of heavier stuff from Joe and Logan. Like Aaron said towards the beginning of the discussion, Tea Cake allows Janie to become the more fun-loving, spirited woman she was longing to be throughout her entire marriage to Joe.
Janie is a very interesting character but I want to discuss is not really her character so much as the person that Joe tried to create out of her and the image of her that he created for all of the people in the town. He wanted to make her special and higher than everyone else but in the process he ends up isolating her from everyone. He creates a person that the town feels is almost untouchable. She is separated from everyone and as a result is lonely. After excluding Janie from the mule’s funeral he returns home and finds her upset. The narrator describes his thoughts; “Here he was just pouring honor all over her; building a high chair for her to sit in and overlook the world and she here pouting over it!” (62). He was setting her apart from the other townspeople on purpose to try to make her into a woman of a higher class than all of the others. She does not want to “overlook the world”, she wants to be a part of it. The people of Eatonville instead of respecting her more or thinking extremely highly of her just left her alone. He set her apart from the town to make her more special in his own eyes. The woman he created was quite and dignified but was more of a trophy to show off than a wife or a part of the community.
ReplyDeleteOne of my favorite things about Their Eyes Were Watching God, is author Zora Neale Hurston’s use of contrast with the characters Lee Coker, Hicks, and Joe Starks. When Joe Starks first heard rumors of an all colored town he envisioned a well-established place with lots of land and a government, when he arrived he was disappointed. He found a small collection of shacks on a small piece of land with no form of government in site, populated by lazy, demotivated men. Among these men are Lee Croker and Hicks; they are described as sitting under a tree all-day and gossiping. Joe Starks is a bold dreamer who wants to make the town into a legitimate establishment. Joe Starks wants to move ahead where as Lee Croker and Hicks just want to relax and enjoy their freedom. It is obvious from an early point in the story that Joe Starks is far better equipped to lead this town then any of the men who created it.
ReplyDeleteHi all, I want to bring up the idea about Tea Cake and how he acts differently from the other two husbands that Janie had been with. Janie didn’t suffer any jealousy from the other two husbands since she did not love them, but with Tea Cake she experiences jealousy: “Janie learned what it felt like to be jealous”. Zora describes the jealously like “a little seed of fear was growing into a tree”. This description shows that the jealousy starts as a very small thing that grows over time into something much more dramatic (quotations from p.136). In Janie’s other two marriages there was no love but also no jealously on Janie’s part. For the first time in a relationship: Janie is not entire sure of her security in the relationship for example when she catches the “chunky” girl and Tea Cake together she asks “what’s de matter heah? Janie asked in a cold rage” (p.137). what had started as a microscopic worry of an idea had blown up into a physical fight
ReplyDeleteJoe Starks
ReplyDeleteAfter Janie is married to Logan it seems all the joy has flooded out of her life, it is monotonous. The unexpected arrival of Joe Starks adds a little splotch of color to her dull existence. To Janie, Jody is her knight in shining armor, the embodiment of her dreams for marriage and Joe does nothing if not encourage these ideas of himself. Janie's decision to leave a stable marriage and run off with Joe shows that she has not completely forgotten her dreams of a sweet life. She still is the young girl under the pear tree dreaming. Sadly, after some time with Jody she realizes he is, also, not the one for her. Joe is the stage in Janie's life where she does something reckless young and then regrets it later. He is her middle ground, better then Logan, but not as good as Tea Cake in her eyes. Unlike Logan, Jody's flaws as a match for Janie are not immediately apparent, they show over time. His possessiveness, pride, and fear are his downfalls.
Joe treats Janie the same as the townspeople, controlling and deserving. His attitude is “ I have made you what you are, now praise me and all my possessions and power.” I think Joe is a less extreme example of twisted by power. Without his control he would just be cocky and self-assured, not boastful and demanding. His character and his relationship with Janie would have been much more satisfactory if they had gone to a different small town and maybe started a store there. In that case he would have some power so he could be satisfied, but not so much that he changes for the worse.
Tea Cake and Starks both physically abuse Janie. With Tea Cake, it appears to be portrayed much less harshly. This makes absolutely no sense. When Starks hit her, he did it because she failed to meet his expectations. When Tea Cake did it, it was because of actions out of her control. So let's reiterate. One punished her for her actions by hitting her, another punished her for someone else's actions by hitting her. What's the difference? In the case of Starks, his actions make perfect sense(even if they are excessive), yet in the case of Tea Cake, his actions are completely emotionally driven and illogical. And of these two characters it's Tea Cake who's supposed to be favored? Starks, while a jerk, at least seems to be principled and somewhat fair. Tea Cake is dangerous, irresponsible, and impulsive. Yet because these are traits Janie seems to somewhat like, Tea Cake ends up seeming like a better person to the reader even though by most indicators he's really much more flawed.
ReplyDeleteThere's a brief decision made by Janie that really bugs me. When Starks tells her she couldn't make a speech, she becomes upset, but then she concludes(I paraphrase), "I'm capable of making a speech if I wanted to". It seems like like she's trying to protect her ego. Kind of like an under achieving kid who insists that they could succeed if they applied themselves. The fact that she doesn't pursue the issue further really indicates to me that she's afraid of finding out that she actually COULDN'T make a speech. Just the whole nature of that makes her seem really insecure, but that's not really a huge part of her character at this point in the book. It just seems out of place.
ReplyDeleteLehna Cohen
ReplyDelete9th Grade english
From the beginning of the book in which she is a child living in an anglo house and raised from the prospect that the world is color blind, Janie shows her character off. She is an intelligent young girl, curious about her surroundings and courageous enough to experience what exactly the world has to offer. As she grows older her beauty matures. No man can keep their wandering eyes and lustful hands off her. She has the confidence as a young, beautiful woman to explore all her possibilities. Janie leaves her first husband, Logan. She is powerful. As this story unfolds I come to find that behind that hard exterior Janie struggles with leaving Logan. By leaving him she disobeys what her grandmother has instilled in her. Though Jody taunts her with a life of luxury and his smooth tongue, it is not lost on Janie that her grandmother would disapprove. Her lust to explore mixed with vulnerability is what keeps this story riveting and exciting. What I wonder is what side will she choose? For Janie marriage is a secure yet stifling environment. Security versus freedom. With freedom what will she find? Could it possibly be herself?
Erica,
ReplyDeleteI agree with your point about how Joe wanting Jainie to be the ideal wife of the mayor and to be looked upon with admiration ends up creating a wife that is only ideal to him. As he gets so preoccupied with his status and the ways in which he expects his wife to be and feel, he ends up pushing her away from him and assumes that she is ungrateful when she is not happy with her new image. Although he thinks he is doing her a favor, Jainie feels contained and lonely. I agree with you that he aims to make her special in his own eyes and I think by doing this he ends up dictating her actions to such an extent that he never learns about her actual character.
I find the final state of Janie’s relationship with Tea Cake prior to the hurricane to be slightly… perplexing. Throughout reading the book, the reader gets the impression of Janie as a character that needs her independence to be happy. Almost all of her major actions seem to be driven by this urge to be a free and independent woman. She leaves Logan because he confines her and isn’t what she wants. Joe presents an opportunity for freedom, so she takes it. Tea Cake, like Joe once did, at the beginning of his relationship with Janie represents the freedom of an “equal relationship” and a deviation from the oppression and sexism. Janie describes her reason for leaving Eatonville to Pheoby as, “Naw, Pheoby, Tea Cake ain’t draggin’ me off nowhere Ah don’t want tuh go. Ah always did want tuh git round uh whole heap, but Jody wouldn’t ‘low me tuh”(112). She wants away from the town she’s lived in for the last twenty some years and to see the world. I consider that a pursuit of freedom and happiness. One would expect that the relationship that Janie wants is something that is lacking all of the problems that she had with Joe and Logan. However, the resulting relationship that Janie has with Tea Cake is a rather confusing hybrid of all of the problems of her earlier marriages(after the courting at least). Tea Cake is quite protective and possessive of her and Janie(contrary to my expectations of her, goes with it), “Janie is wherever Ah wants tuh be. Dat’s de kind uh wife she is and Ah love her for it”(148). She follows his every word, allows him to beat her and yet is still happy. In essence, the relationship she has with Tea Cake brings about new revelations in her character. She doesn’t need to be truly free to be happy, just respected and loved.
ReplyDeleteHey it's Daniel. I'm not that far in the book so bear with me here.
ReplyDeleteI think that Janie’s interaction with Joe Starks shows Janie’s fear to be in a better place. His claims of heading to Florida and living a more grandiose life were quite appealing to Janie but I think the way Joe carries himself in the conversation by being flirtatious and condescending was what made Janie stay. While she’s somewhat smitten with Joe I think that the key part of their relationship is that Joe represents what life on the outside is like: it’s flashy and ambitious. Janie is attracted to Joe but I think that the fact that he represents this sort of big city ideology is also off-putting to her. Florida is full of mystery and unpredictability, much like that of Joe’s character. Being in a new place is both promising and frightening and to me, Janie is not really that brave of a character and she doesn’t really possess the bravery it takes to confront these kinds of factors by moving away.
Pheoby Watson
ReplyDeletePheoby is an honest, kind woman who lives in Eatonville. She is Janie’s best friend and is very loyal to her, as shown in chapter one when she says “Anyhow, what you ever know her to do so bad as y’all make out? The worst thing Ah ever knowed her to do was taking a few years offa her age and dat ain’t never harmed nobody” (3). She also brings Janie dinner when Janie comes home. She offers good advice to Janie after Janie confronts Joe about his rude words (79). She accepts Janie for who she is without trying to change her. Although Pheoby does caution Janie against being with Tea Cake, she doesn’t hold a grudge when Janie doesn’t listen. Overall, Pheoby seems to be the ideal best friend for Janie.
Hey guys I want to try and start a discussion about Hezekiah Potts. Hezekiah is the assistant at Joe’s store. When Joe dies, Hezekiah starts to mimic Joe’s actions. He starts by doing little things such as smoking the same cigars as Joe did in the same manner as Joe did. He even start’s talking like Joe using some of his favorite expressions such as “Ah’m an educated man, Ah keep my arrangements in my hands”(92). He also feels the need to try telling Janie what to do and tries to advise her against seeing Tea Cake. Janie feels free from the power of Joe and laughs at Hezekiah’s Joe like actions. He’s not a huge part of the novel. I feel like it was interesting choice for Hurston to kill Joe and then create a character that is replaces Joe in personality but giving him a different role than Joe had.
ReplyDeleteI was really impressed, while reading the novel, by the level of complexity of each of the characters. Specifically, I found it interesting the way that characters could seem so modern and progressive in some ways, while still being very traditional in other ways.
ReplyDeleteFor example, while Janie’s first husband Logan Killicks lives a fairly traditional lifestyle, considering the time period and is social class, he still makes statements such as, “You ain’t got no particular place,” (21) which seem to contradict the expected gender roles, which would dictate that housework would be Janie’s main duty.
In an almost opposite example, her second husband, Joe Starks has progressive ideas about the world. He shows clear intentions of improving Eatonville, a city that contrasts the entire rest of the South. However, while he leads a modern, and glamorous life, when speaking about Janie he says, “She’s uh woman and her place is in de home.”
This kind of opposition seems to add a lot of depth to the characters, and it also keeps any of the characters from seeming either saintly or completely evil.
Hi, this is Genevieve, a Junior. I've been having problems with the blog; I wrote this entry in early July but am only now able to upload.
ReplyDeleteAddressing the second question in the prompt above, I would say that Janie's relationships with her three husbands don't "complicate and help to resolve the plot;" they are the plot. The novel's "plot" isn't made up of 170 pages of concrete events that lead us to a hurricane; it's about how Janie grows and changes as a woman, especially in response the treatment she receives from Logan, Jody and Tea Cake. There is no way to "complicate" the plot as it was never a linear path to begin with – it’s the story of her life. Any shenanigans that happen along the way are only enriching the story of Janie's evolution as a woman and human.
Janie’s first marriage – to a sixty-odd-year-old man named Logan Killicks – is, in terms of length, the least successful of her three marriages. It ends quickly due to two factors, the first of which being Janie’s headstrong, willful personality. The fact that she’s married to a much-older man who demands more from her than she sees fair does nothing to lessen her inner fire, and she sees no problem with arguing with Logan when she sees fit: "Ah'm just as stiff as you is stout. If you can sand not to chop and tote wood Ah reckon you can stand not to git no dinner. 'Scuse mah freezolity, Mist' Killicks, but Ah don't mean to chop de first chip" (26).
The second factor contributing to the brevity of this marriage is Joe (Jody) Starks, a charismatic city man who bewitches Janie with flattery and talk of his grand political ambitions. She leaves Logan quickly after meeting Joe and goes with him, hopeful for their future in her relative naïveté. Soon after marrying him, however, she finds that all is not as she was led to believe it would be: Joe has warped expectations of Janie’s needs and desires, expecting her to be docile, submissive and without emotion. Considering the plot as an emotional journey, here comes a major turning point: Janie, always one to fight injustice and stand up for her own well-being, becomes exactly what Joe demands her to be. Talking to her friend Phoeby, she says, “’Ah’m stone ead from standin’ still and tryin’ tuh smile’” (83). Near the end of their almost 20 years of marriage, she finally realizes that in her efforts to be the wife he wants, she has been forcing herself to be a completely different person, one dead of passion, gumption, or any of the other things that had made her distinctive and wonderful.
(This is getting much more long-winded than I intended so I’ll wind it up.) A short while after Jody’s death, Janie meets Tea Cake whom, according to the notes at the end, she considers to be the love of her life. In Tea Cake she finds a partner, not a husband to control and manipulate her but a companion with whom she can share all of herself. After he comes home wounded from a gambling evening gone wrong, she’s not angry, but “felt a self-crushing love. So her soul crawled out from its hiding place” (128). This is the first time in her life that Janie has felt the ability to love someone completely, despite their flaws, and is another turning point in the emotional plot. Although her time with Tea Cake is cut short after only a few years, she does not end up bitter at his death; after a period of profound grief and trauma concerning the way he died, she realizes that their love was so strong to the last that Tea Cake’s spirit will always be with her: “Of course he wasn’t dead. He could never be dead until she herself had finished feeling and thinking. The kiss of his memory made pictures of love and light against the wall. Here was peace” (193). Janie has learned to find peace in love and in loss and has found completion in another person; the emotional journey chronicled in the novel has reached its conclusion.
I haven't actually finished the book yet so I do not know how Janie's relationship with Tea Cake works out, but I have noticed some similarities in her relationships.
ReplyDeleteThe first is an article of clothing as a symbol of oppression. When Janie leaves Logan she throws her apron aside, and I think that that is her freeing herself from him. With Joe, the head rag is much more deeply developed. She hates to wear it but he forces her to, it represents his control over her. The reason he makes her wear the head rag is fear that someone will fall in love with her hair and take her from him. Joe wants Janie to be his alone and believes that her hair should exist only for him. When Janie leaves him she burns all her head rags. With Logan she merely tossed him aside, with Joe she is burning his memory away.
The other similarity is that what attracts Janie is difference, something new. Logan was content to live out his life without making huge changes; she leaves him for Joe, ambitious, charismatic, with big plans for his life. Joe, who prevented her from joining word-play and fun, who was the serious mayor of the town; free of him she turns to Tea Cake, who is witty, who plays checkers with her, and who has little gravity in life. After her marriages fail, Janie turns to a man who is the complete opposite of her last husband.
I find Natalie B’s comment to be a strong analysis of Janie’s transformation throughout the novel. I think that the symbolism of Janie’s clothes and how she decides to (or is forced to) wear them expresses how she was treated by the men she married. When she does leave Joe for Tea Cake, she appears to have slightly more control over her life as their relationship develops.
ReplyDeleteHi, Maria here. I'd like to talk about Tea Cake and also about his relationship with Janie. (I have not finished the book yet and have only read up through the courtship between him and Janie)
ReplyDeleteJanie was filled with a sense of wonder at the onset of both her previous marriages, but overall she seemed more excited about the lifestyle she hoped to find. That's not to say she didn't love or was trying to love this men she was with (in the cases of Jody and Logan, respectively), but she didn't have a lot of time to get to know these men or spend time with them before she got married to them. So she is thrust into the lifestyle of being a wife before she can fully know her husband.
With Teacake, there is a better sense of courtship. The style of the writing changes and the way Janie and Tea Cake interact with one another is much more akin to that of a relationship she would have had when she was 16, if she hadn't been married to Logan.
While Tea Cake and Janie are getting to know each other, they do fun things together, like spontaneously going off to fish after midnight:
"[S]he felt like a child breaking the rules. That's what made Janie like it. … [afterwards] she had to smuggle Tea Cake out by the back gate that made it seem like some great secret she was keeping from the town." (102)
Tea Cake is much more fun-loving and happy than most of the other characters, and Janie is attracted to his youth and spirit. He's more open-minded about what a woman can and cannot do, and he doesn't let social standards have an effect on his feelings.
When Janie is worried about their age difference, he explains that who she is as a person means more to him than the negative social connotation of dating an older woman:
"'Ah done thought all about dat and tried tuh struggle against it, but it don't do me no good. De thought uh mah youngness don't satisfy me lak yo presence do.'" (105)
I've heard that Tea Cake becomes abusive later on (though I haven't read that far), but so far, he seems like an open-minded, caring person, and everything that Janie needed and never had in a relationship.
I agree with Maria. For the first time Janie actually thinks and gets to know the man she is about to marry before actually marrying him. She gives herself time to get to know him before making such a big decision. Also her third marriage is the only one were she doesnt feel pressure in making a decision to marry. With Logan she was pressured by her grandmother to marry him so that she would be taken care of after her grandmother died. Then with Joe she felt like she needed him to escape her unhappy marriage. She didnt have time to stop and think she just needed to get away. With Teacake she had the means to support herself and she really didnt need anyone. She got to choose to marry him for love and not for any other reason.
ReplyDeleteI also agree with what Maria said, and I just wanted to add that it always seemed to me that Janie is always trying to find somebody that she can truly love, and is open minded towards the people she meets. That said, and this has already been stated, she never truly has the opportunity to have the healthy relationship prior to marriage that is needed to lead a happy married life.
ReplyDeleteIn Zora Neal Hurston’s book, “Their Eyes Were Watching God,” Hurston writes that the main character Janie, “saw her life like a great tree in leaf with the things suffered, things enjoyed, things done and undone. Dawn and doom was in the branches. “ (pg. 8) To Janie, her life, with all of its experiences and emotions, and all its ups and downs, is like a tree, with each branch a different path in her life she takes that help her grow as a person. Together, these experiences make up Janie, the whole, blossoming tree.
ReplyDeleteI think that one of the most interesting ways that Hurston shows us who Janie is – all of the different branches that make up her whole and help her become the person she is at the end of the story - is through the various emotions Janie experiences throughout the story and her life. These different emotions make Janie come alive to the reader. They help us to empathize with Janie, and they make it easy to relate to her character. The character reacts like a real person would to her experiences, which are many and varied.
For instance, she experiences surprise at the beginning of the story when she sees herself in a photograph and realizes for the first time that she is African-American, and not white. She experiences emotional pain and suffering when her grandmother beats her and then forces her to marry a man she does not love, Logan Killicks. She experiences regret when she gives into her grandmother and gives up her hope that when she marries Logan she will feel love. She feels hopeful when she runs off with Joe Starks. She feels pity for an ill treated mule, but then she is thankful when Joe buys him and he is no longer abused. And then, later she feels sadness when Joe hurts her physically and mentally. She feels anger and pity towards him when he dies and relief when she is single again. When she meets Tea Cake, she likes him but feels reserve, suspicious of his motives. When she falls in love with him and they marry, she is happy. And when a big storm comes and she and Tea Cake try to get away, she feels pity for a cold and weak Tea Cake and tries to wrap him in a piece of tarp to keep him warm. When she thinks she may drown she is full of fear and afraid of a rabid dog, and then, she feels concern and worry for Tea Cake when he is bitten by the dog.
At the end of the story, after she has experienced the loss of Tea Cake and misses him, she returns to Eatonville. And although she has been through a great tragedy, she feels peaceful because of the love she shared with Tea Cake. It is as if all of the emotions she has experienced have led her to a place of rest, the end of her journey of self-discovery.
(Riley Winograd)
Early in the novel “Their Eyes Were Watching God,” Hurston describes how her main character, Janie, is lying under a pear tree and sees a bee gathering pollen from a blossom:
ReplyDelete"She saw a dust-bearing bee sink into the sanctum of a bloom; the thousand sister-calyxes arch to meet the love embrace and the ecstatic shiver of the tree from root to tiniest branch creaming in every blossom and frothing with delight. So this was a marriage!" (pg. 11)
I think this passage is a very important part of the book, because the story is about Janie’s search for true love, and in this passage, she sees that two things, (the bee and the blossom,) were created to help one another, and be together and that’s the kind of love Janie wants. The story is Janie’s search for this kind of love. She experiences many types of love in the story, but only at the end does she find the type of love she is looking for.
The first type of love Janie experiences is from her grandmother she calls “Nanny.” Nanny’s love is very possessive and protective. She doesn’t let Janie make her own decisions. Because she failed with her own daughter Leafy, she thinks Janie is her second chance to get things right. She forces Janie to marry Logan Killicks, who gives Janie another type of love. Logan believes that love is working together, such as caring for the farm. He likes keeping things even and sharing the chores: as Janie plows, he chops wood, she takes care of the potatoes and he buys a mule. For him, work is life and Janie is his partner who will do it with him. Although Janie wants a partner and someone to love, this is not the sort of love Janie wants. And so she runs off with Joe Starks. Joe Starks is a very ambitious man who treats Janie more as a possession than a wife. Janie has a friendship with a woman named Phoeby Watson. This is not a romantic love, but a friendly, sisterly love. When Janie pities a poor mule this is also love. When Joe finally dies and Janie meets Tea Cake, she finds in him the type of love she was searching for. Tea Cake thinks she’s smart, and lets her do all the things Joe forbid her to do. The first time Tea Cake meets her, he teachers her to play checkers, which Joe said she was too stupid to learn. This is the kind of love Janie wanted because she and Tea Cake need each other. He asks her to work with him not because he wants her to work, but because he misses her when she’s not around.
Although Janie is terribly sad when Tea Cake dies, she feels calm, no longer restless, because she had finally found what she was looking for, and she still has him in her heart. As Hurston writes, “The kiss of memory made pictures of love and light against the wall. Here was peace.” (pg. 193)
(Riley Winograd)
Joe Starks makes for an interesting topic for a character study. When we first meet Joe, he seems like a very nice person. He takes Janie away from her first husband, buys Jaine lots of presents, and treats he very well. However, he progresses as a character in a bad way. One example is that he slowly treats Janie worse and worse as the story continues. I think that he did this because of his job as mayor. He probably thought that his duties as mayor were more important then Janie. By the time he died, he didn't even want to see her anymore. I saw that this was going to happen because of Joe’s strong will and domineering qualities. Though he wasn’t very nice to Janie, he was a very interesting character.
ReplyDeleteI would like to discuss Mrs. Turner. I find her to be one of the most interesting and frusterating minor characters in the novel. She is black but she hates black people and is most proud of her ‘white features’. She has taken on the same views as white people and has told herself that her white features raise her above other African Americans. I found it really interesting how she views Janie as a god simply because she has even more white features than Mrs. Turner herself. She does not just respect her more she practically worships her. She finds being more white than others to be extremely important and bases her treatment of others on how white they are. She is willing to take any amount of cruelty in order to stay in the good graces of one more white than herself, i.e. Janie. She believes that, “[A]nyone who looked more white folkish than herself was better than she was in her criteria, therefore it was right that they should be cruel to her at times, just as she was cruel to those more negroid than herself in direct ratio to their negroness” (144). I actually find this very sad; the oppressed has become the oppressor almost. She is self-degrading and believes that she deserves cruelty because of her black features. I also find it very interesting how this book has not shown much racism, partly because there have been almost no white characters, and that it is now coming from an African American character instead.
ReplyDeleteI agree that without any pressure, Janie is able to find a more successful relationship, however what's interesting to me is that although marrying someone of the same class in the book seems like the ideal lifestyle, Janie finds happiness elsewhere by as Lucas stated, being open minded and having a desire for a loving relationship.
ReplyDeleteIn the chapters where she starts becoming closer to Tea Cake, other people in the town start pressuring her to stay away from him because he's different from most people in their community and seem to dislike him but Janie doesn't listen to them. This makes me wonder why, is it because she thinks they are just jealous of her relationship with him? Or because she's learned to do what feels right for her?
I'd like to quickly respond to Abby's post on the 28th. (this is rather delayed as a response, I realize.)
ReplyDeleteJoe Starks seems constantly keep Janie from interacting with people or engaging in anything that interests her, and Abby suggested that this is because Starks sees and fears Janie's potential. I'm sort of fascinated by the idea of Janie intimidating Starks, because their whole relationship does seem to be a balance between his desire for a sophisticated and impressive wife and his expectation of a wife who will obey him unquestioningly.
Janie almost comes to fill both of these roles, but for very different reasons. It seems that she wants to be sophisticated, and different and be able to have a flashy, charming husband like Joe Starks. At the same time, being a submissive and well-behaved wife is so ingrained in her that she doesn't seem to be able to leave that behind.
While these ideas are quite conflicting, it seems to be the because they are both such integral parts of Janie's character, that Janie and Joe are brought together.
I wanted to talk about the way Janie handles her relationships and ow she goes about handling them. Specifically, I wanted to talk about her relationship with Logan. This is here first big brush with reality, and she goes only wanting to please nanny and little else, as shown in this quote; "De thought uh you bein' kicked around from pillar tuh post is uh hurtin' thing. every tear you drop squeezes a cup uh blood outa mah heart. Ah got tuh try and do for you befo' mah head is cold."
ReplyDeleteShe wants to be happy and supposes that love and happiness is a byproduct of marriage. When she begins to discover the harsh truth and starts to suffer from a abusive relationship, decides not to face it, but instead she runs away with another man abandoning her relationship, which she has every right to do, it was a toxic marriage and she was also doing what she thought nanny would have wanted. This also shows how ever that she is not a very confrontational person, and run from her problems.
I want to talk about Janie and Pheoby’s friendship. I noticed both characters try to be rational but they have different ideas about rationality. Janie thinks more about what is rational for herself while Pheoby uses what other people think to determine what is rational. Pheoby considers Janie’s action’s to be crazy but Janie proves her rationality by showing she thought her actions through. Hurston shows that in this quote,
ReplyDeleteJanie everybody’s talkin’ bout how dat Tea Cake is draggin’ you round tuh places you ain’t used tuh. Baseball games and huntin’ and fishin’. He don’t know you’se uster uh more high time crowd than dat. You always did class off.
Jody classed me off. Ah didn’t. Naw, Pheoby Tea Cake ain’t draggin’ me nowhere Ah don’t what tuh go. Ah always did want tuh git round uh whole heap, But Jody wouldn’t ‘low me tuh (112.)
Pheoby is worried about what the neighborhood thinks of Janie. She wants to protect Janie, but Janie has already thought her decisions through, and she knows what is best for herself. Janie shows she thinks through her decisions rationally and doesn’t think about what the neighbors think of her.
Joe Starks (who I keep wanting to call Tony Starks because I am the biggest Wu-Tang fan/nerd ever) is by far the most interesting character in Zora Neale Hurston's Their Eyes Were Watching God. He is introduced to the reader as an ambitious and just man who dreams of making the all African American town a legitimate establishment. In doing so he becomes mayor. Along with this new responsibility come many changes in Joe's character. He builds a big white house to live in and indulges in many of the commodity's he had seen white people have in the past. He begins treating his citizens like he is above them intellectually. In some ways he begins to deny his own humanity in order to look down on the other townspeople. He begins regarding them as crude, lazy, immoral, unintelligent, and vulgar. In order to maintain his belief that he is better then his citizens Joe never laughs at any of their jokes or partakes in anything “fun”, instead he puts on a persona that constantly shows off his superior intellect. The most interesting example of this is on page 54, “Janie noted that while he didn't talk the mule himself he sat and laughed at it. Laughed his big heh, heh laugh too. But when Lige or Sam or Walter or some of the other big picture talkers were using a side of the world for a canvas, Joe would hustle her off inside the store to sell something.” Joe sits inside and laughs secretly but never partakes in any gossip so all the citizens think he is a perfect man. Another interesting thing about this quote is that Joe doesn't seem to want Janie to know that citizens of the town other then him are intelligent and so he rushes her out whenever they “use a side of the world for a canvas.” This is most likely because he is extremely protective of Janie and wants to make sure she has absolutely no interest in other townsfolk but as a result Janie is forced to live a boring life locked up in the store or the post office.
ReplyDeleteHi everyone, i would like to talk about the the mule's death.
ReplyDeleteOne of the things that I like was the fact that everyone except Matt treated the mule as if it was a human being, and part of the community. I found it interesting because it shows their personality and their true feelings toward animals. They also describe his intelligence to be able to understand people and communicate with them as well. In addition Zora Hurston decides to give us more detail regarding his humanity by describing his feelings about his death:" he had seen death coming and had stood his ground and fought it like a natural man. he had fought it to the last breath"(59). This is one of the many times in which the characters view the animals more like humans. This quote also stands because it describes their tradition and it shows their connection with animals.
Hopefully you guys are able to relate to this comment.
Sometimes it seems like Janie wants people to talk and gossip about her, most of the time it just seems like she doesn’t care what most people think because she wears the clothes a young woman would wear, and does other things she supposedly shouldn’t do and ignores the gossipers. But on later on after Janie and moves out of Eatonville With Tea Cake she makes up people gossiping about her and Tea Cake. “…she was not shocked at Tea Cakes gambling. It was part of him, so it was alright. She rather found herself angry at the imaginary people who might try to criticize. Let those old Hypocrites learn to mind their own business, and leave other folks alone. Tea Cake wasn’t doing a bit more harm trying to win himself a little money than they was always doing with their lying tongues” (P.125-126). This quote made me think that maybe she wants to stand out and be talked about, and she’s not just doing things because she wants to, like wearing blue because Tea Cake likes it.
ReplyDeleteHey all, I wanted to talk about Janie and Logan, not necessarily their relationship with each other (although that will come up), but as characters in the novel.
ReplyDeleteLogan Killicks is much older than Janie, but he is heavily infatuated with her. This shows a lot in the beginning of their relationship, as he gives her every luxury he can and does as much as he can for her. Naturally, such behavior cannot last long, and after a bit, Logan tries to settle into a normal routine. He asks her to do a reasonable amount of the work, and is perfectly civil to her. As he sees her disinterest and near hatred of him increase, his attempts at romance and companionship become increasingly few, and eventually cease, but that is to be expected when they are so often rejected. He still loves her, but he is reluctant to show it for fear of her disapproval and harshness. After Janie threatens to leave Logan, Hurston writes, "The thought put a terrible ache in Logan's body, but he thought it best to put on scorn.... He flopped over resentful in his agony and pretended to sleep. He hoped that he had hurt her as she had hurt him." Logan does love Janie, more than she ever understands. He stops showing it because she scorns it, and he fears rejection and protects his pride. When Logan tries to settle into married life, in which he cannot do all of the work for Janie, she sees it as an offensive demand of labor. At some points, Logan does seem a bit demanding, as he seems to want her to do the housework as well as an equal half of the plowing and outdoor work, but he is never really unfair. Janie shows childish naivety and selfishness in the beginning of the novel, first in blatantly insulting Logan and refusing to see him as anything but unfair. In the quote above, she does not see through his proud display of indifference to notice that he loves her and is hurt by her hatred of him. Although she cannot be expected to love him, she is unnecessarily harsh. She has no second thoughts about leaving him without knowing what kind of man she is leaving him for, which is a foolish and dangerous thing to do. At this point in the novel, her decisions do not reflect strength and free spirit so much as childish carelessness. She wants a new and exciting thing, so she up and leaves with someone she barely knows. Throughout her relationships, though, she changes. I have not gotten very far in the book, but it is clear in the first chapter that she has lost her naivety and gained real strength. She wears what she does because there is no reason for her to wear dresses, and it is a waste of money. I'm not clear on the specifics, but she seemed to have been working out of town to stay with Tea Cake, the man she loved. When he was "gone," she left for the town and the best life she could make for herself without him. When she walks through the town, she is perfectly aware of what people think of her, she just chooses not to care, where as with Logan, she barely realizes how much she hurts him and how much he loves her. Janie is always an individual, but what makes her so morphs from naivety into strength.
Tea Cake
ReplyDeleteHi, I would like to talk about Tea Cake's personality and his influence on Janie's personality. Mainly how their relationship changed Janie for the better. Tea Cake, in a way, freed her. His open jubilation and fun-loving nature helped guide Janie from a life slump to re-embracing her not-so-fleeting youth.
Throughout Tea Cake's existence in the book my impression of his personality was an easygoing, silly guy who was just high on life and lived in the moment. Up until Mrs. Turner is introduced, he never has a bad thing to say about anyone. His heart seems to overflow with pleasure about life and its many ups and downs. Tea Cake is exactly what Janie had wanted all her life, but only needed when she was older.
In my opinion Tea Cake is the most likable character in the book. He is hard-working, honest, sweet, and truly cares about Janie. His appearance in the storyline is a joy to a lost Janie and a threat to many other men who wish to marry her. I think their relationship is sweet and simple, they would do anything for each other and they do. Over all I think Tea Cake is the best influence on Janie and the kindest character in the book.
Part 1 of 2 (Aleia)
ReplyDeleteIn literature as in life, lessons come through experiences and reoccurring themes. Hurston's classic, Their Eyes Were Watching God, describes the personal growth of a black woman growing up in the south during the 1930's. Between Janie's three marriages, she finds a balanced outlook on the world as well as within herself. Her first marriage to Logan Killicks teaches her the truth behind magic and fairy tales, marriage, and the responsibilities housewives on farms. As a young girl, she believes that love follows marriage. Hurston writes, “ She knew now that marriage did not make love. Janie's first dream was dead, so she became a woman”(25). The death of this dream was the beginning of a turning point for Janie. Although she was discouraged, she was reluctant to give up searching for love in her life and impulsively leaves the farm and runs away with Joe Starks. Joe wants to treat Janie the way he feels a woman ought to be treated. Joe says to Janie, “. . . you is made sit on de front porch and rock and fan yo'self and eat p'taters dat other folks cook just special for you. . . . De day you put yo' hands in mine, Ah wouldn't let the sun goes down on us single. . . . You ain't never knowed what it was to be treated lak a lady”(29). Joe's sweet talk encourages her to follow him to Maitland, Florida(34). Janie's next marriage to Joe ends up teaching Janie many lessons about herself and how to deal with others. As both Janie and Joe grow older, Joe becomes fickle from watching himself deteriorate as Janie does not (since they have a considerably big gap in age). Janie also learns the most lessons from this relationship from being with him over twenty years(82):
1. It is not always best to act on impulse.
Janie ends up being very unhappy in her marriage with Joe. She learns self control when dealing with his condescending remarks to not escalate a conflict. Hurston describes, “. . . he slapped Janie until she had a ringing sound in her ears. . . things packed up in parts of her heart where she could never find them. . . . She had an inside and an outside and suddenly she knew how not to mix them”(72). Janie learns tact as well as the ability to suppress her feelings to protect herself.
2. The theme of responsibility occurs again as Janie worked in the store as well as a housewife.
3. As Joe becomes a bitter old man, he starts to treat Janie with less and less respect. She notices that growing older, makes him feel envious toward her about his dilapidating body, while she remains as limber as ever. He treats her like she does not act her age when he says “You'se uh ole hen now. . . . Dat's something for de young folks”(77). Hurston then describes Janie's resiliency and ability to rationalize Joe's accusations, “If he thought to deceive her, he was wrong”(77).
4. Janie also learns that money is best friends with trouble. She realizes that money is not a synonym for love when their marriage begins to go downhill, despite their economic success and Joe's gifts. Hurston writes, “She got nothing from [Joe] except what money can buy, and she was giving away what she didn't value”(76). Janie learns that money nor marriage makes love.
Part 2 of 2 (Aleia)
ReplyDeleteJanie's most successful marriage to Vergible (Tea Cake) Woods reinforces certain themes and lessons; which additionally encourages new beginnings and new perspectives. The theme of responsibility of work is reinforced when they pick beans in Ocala. 'Money is not a synonym for love' becomes reinforced when she is first falling in love with Tea Cake. Before and after they were married, Tea Cake either retrieves the gifts from his own hard work or uses his own hard-earned money; “. . . fresh caught trout for a present. . . Tea Cake was spending and doing out of his own pocket”(103, 117). This contrast is important for Janie between her past marriages since Tea Cake already shows that he is willing take care of her, money or no money. Janie also learns about faith, trust and new beginnings. Tea Cake and Janie both become jealous if someone seems to be the least bit interested in one of them. Hurston depicts, “Still and all, jealousies arose now and then on both sides”(147). When realizing that each care for each other more than anything else in the world, their faith and trust in the relationship helps them grow as people as well as a couple. The most intimate scene in the book is after Janie accuses Tea Cake of cheating on her and eying younger women. Hurston describes their first fight:
“ 'Ah b'lieve you been messin 'round her!' 'No sich uh thing!' Tea Cake retorted. . . . they wrestled until they were doped with their own fumes and emanations. . .”(137). This important conflict scene turns into a passionate love sequence in the book to portray how fervid their relationship is.
Each of her marriages give Janie a chance for a fresh start. Logan Killicks introduces her to the married life. Joe Starks introduces a second chance to happiness; as well as Tea Cake does the third. Hurston writes to describe Janie's outlook on the new relationship, “That was the beginning of things”(107). Each marriage calls Janie to a new adventure, and each adventure entails a new beginning. Janie's many lessons do not destroy her childhood dreams, yet make them rational to help them come true.
I agree with Theo’s comment about Janie, how “she doesn’t need to be truly free to be happy, just respected and loved.” However, when Tea Cake openly hits her to show his dominance over her, he is treating her as property. Possessions aren’t necessarily given respect. Janie isn’t always given the respect that she deserves in her relationship. Shortly after Janie arrives in Jacksonville, she wakes up one morning to find that two hundred dollars and Tea Cake is missing. After a stress-filled day, for Janie, Tea Cake returns, having spent almost all the money on a banquet and purposes of entertainment. Tea Cake sometimes uses her to receive what he wants.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI sort of agree with part of what Lev posted back in mid-July. He wrote, “She [Janie] seems like she wants to become a woman, and find love, but she doesn’t like what womanhood entails.” Janie truly wants to find love and be happy, although I think she does not like what being a woman means in common society, at the time. Janie’s grandmother strictly believes that because Janie might be attracted to a boy enough to kiss him that she is old enough to become not only a grown woman but also a wife. As a young, constantly changing adolescent, Janie is unsure of society’s demands from her, and also connects love to marriage, which she later finds out is not necessarily true.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Aysha’s comment on how it is quite interesting to think that Janie can actually intimidate Joe Starks. Janie seems to be a generally quiet person when she is married to Starks, however in the store Janie builds up anger inside of her to an exploding point. She seems to “speak softly, and carry a big stick” in a way. Janie tries to carefully and calmly negotiate and bargain with Starks, though he does not listen to her but his own arrogance; he even hits her. Eventually, Janie releases her anger at Starks, and “using the ‘big stick’” thoroughly insults him.
ReplyDeleteBrenden made a comment towards the end of July which I agree with. He wrote, “He [Tea Cake] lives solely in the moment and does not think of the impacts of his actions.” Tea Cake often makes rash actions that typically cause trouble, and harm the general area. For example, in the Everglades, there is a party in Mrs. Turner’s house. Coodemay, Dockery, and Sterrett start a large fight. Tea Cake tries to break it up, but only joins in, and makes it worse: “Tea Cake…fastened down on Coodemay. Dockery grabbed Sterrett and they wrassled all over the place. Some more joined in and dishes and tables began to crash” (151).
ReplyDeleteIn regards to what Zoe said a few posts up, I don’t think Janie necessarily wants to be gossiped about, I think she just chooses to rise above it. I think she’s in a mind set where she believes that if she let the gossiping get to her and took to heart what negative things others had to say, she would be much less happy than she wants and deserves to be. In terms of making up that other people are talking about her, I think she’s just used to hearing gossip about herself. Therefore she expects it of other people, which, in my opinion, shows that she’s more effected by the gossip and lies than she shows.
ReplyDeleteIn late July, Natalie made a comment which I partially agree with. She posted, “By living in a house much grander then the rest, he [Joe Starks] creates a sense of separation from everyone else, he rules over them, he is not one of them. And they come to resent him for this.” Starks is manifested, by Janie, to be more of a tyrant than a citizen, or even a mayor: “The town had a basketful of feelings good and bad about Joe’s positions and possessions, but none had the temerity to challenge him. They bowed down to him, because he was all of these things” (50). The all-African-American townspeople kneel to Starks, but they do not resent him. As a matter of fact, they almost love him. Joe Starks induces grandeur through large, over-the-top openings and building the town. For these reasons, Starks becomes the mayor.
ReplyDeleteAaron,
ReplyDeleteI think I understand your argument that Tea Cake lives in the moment and does not think of the impacts of his actions. However, I do not think the quote you gave quite fits your argument. Tea Cake had prior to the party expressed a strong disliking of Mrs. Turner. Tea Cake probably thought about the impact of joining or stopping the fight. He probably joined in just to spite Mrs. Turner.
Tea Cake was very obviously one of the main perpetrators of the incident that became the fight at Mrs. Turner’s eating house. The way that he expresses his extreme dislike of Mrs. Turner to his wife before the scene at Mrs. Turner’s and then calls her “too nice uh woman” obviously declares to the reader that he is pretending to appreciate her in order to make the fight seem spontaneous so Turner doesn’t suspect that it was a planned event meant to hurt her in some way.
ReplyDeleteJody "Joe" Starks:
ReplyDeleteJody Starks Janie's 2nd husband. Jody is obsessed with maintaining an "illusion of power" and does so by attempting to dominate everyone around him. You could say that he is a complete megalomaniac. He always has to maintain dominance by either purchasing, bullying, or becoming a politician. In normal conversation he is said to have an aura of dominance to him that makes you afraid to recommend an improvement to him or complain in any way. In Janie's words "he needs tuh have his way all his life, trample and mash down and then die ruther than tuh let himself heah bout it.” Pretty much he walks all over everyone and then is so dominant that people are afraid to say anything about it, its just how it is.
Jodie doesn't marry Janie for love but because he thinks she will help him keep his place in society. Jody sees Janie as a "trophy wife" and a tool that can help him assert power over his peers. Unfortunately this does not fulfill Janie's image of a marriage because it requires her to sit quietly in the corner looking pretty and get bossed around by her husband. And unfortunately his tower of imaginary power falling over is what causes the end of him.
I agree a lot with Devon about Joe. He definitely does not marry Janie for the conventional idea of love, although he might think he loves her, and Janie is definitely part of the way he holds power over the rest of the town. However, I am not entirely convinced that he married her specifically as a "trophy wife," as Devon thinks, because he is a very jealous man who hates it when other men even look at her. Joe goes as far as to make Janie wrap her head to hide her hair so that others cannot see it. But he definitely does think that she is better than anyone else in the town and keeps her separate from the common clay as much as possible. I also wonder somewhat whether he considers her lighter skin as superior to other women's, and I'm curious what other people on the blog think about that.
ReplyDeleteResponding to what Luci and Zoe have said about gossiping in the novel, I think Janie neither likes nor dislikes being talked about necessarily. I think it's more that she expects it. When she talks about the imaginary people that might gossip about Tea Cake's gambling, she isn't saying that she wants people to be talking about it, she just assumes they will. Earlier, she brings up the story of an older woman who ran off with a younger man and was tricked by him into giving him her money, which he ran away with. Janie knows the town gossiped cruelly about that woman, and when she lived among the townspeople she probably heard them gossip a lot. Her leaving with Tea Cake was a big deal for the town, and she can assume they are talking about her, and would disapprove of Tea Cake's gambling and probably disapprove of her for allowing it. I think Janie sometimes worries about what other people think or say about her, even if she doesn't let on. She probably imagines the townspeople saying mean things about her and Tea Cake. Although she most likely doesn't want to be imagining that it's almost like she can't help it. I don't think she wants to be gossiped about, but I think she knows it's happening and because of that she can't stop thinking about it.
ReplyDeleteChristopher
ReplyDeleteTea Cake, Janie’s third husband and first true love sparks a brilliant change in Janie’s life. Tea Cake is younger and poorer than Janie, but his humor and spontaneity captivates her and draws her in. Janie's friends warn her of the possibility of Tea Cake being a manipulative younger man going for an older ladies money and power, but Janie sees through them and trusts Tea Cake. As a reader, one cannot help but be wary of Tea Cake for in the beginning of the novel Janie tells her close friend Pheoby “Tea Cake is gone. And dat’s de only reason you see me back here- cause Ah ain’t got nothing to make me happy no more where Ah was at. (7)” With out the full story one might infer that Tea Cake had run off, or had done Janie wrong, but in reality Tea Cake was along with Janie throughout her life till he died. The change that took place in Janie’s life is the most intriguing part of Tea Cake. In essence Janie became younger and lived the first half of her life second. With her second husband Joe Starks, she was locked up under the chains of class and running a store, her wealth and status held her back. Tea Cake on the other hand was like a child, and there relationship was strong and true. They roamed the land and made money ware they could. And although they encountered many hardships Janie never regretted a thing.
“Well” he (Tea Cake) said humbly, “reckon you never ‘spected tuh come tuh dis when you took up wid me, didja?” “Once upon a time, Ah never ‘spected nothing, Tea Cake, but bein’ dead from standing’ still and trying’ tuh laugh. But you come ‘long and made something’ outa me. So Ah’m thankful fuh anything we come through together. (167)”.
Tea Cake was a good man down to the end, and Janie’s love was more true and young towards him than to any other man she was with. There relationship was more natural and strong than any other.
In response to Brandt’s post, I agree with a lot of what he has to say about the character of Joe. Joe certainly did not marry Janie simply to have a trophy wife. I do believe however that he did actually love her. Everyone loves differently, and though his way of expressing his love for Janie may not be what the reader expects, Joe really does seem like he loves her. In response to Brandt’s curiosity on whether or not Joe believes Janie superior to other women due to her skin color, I don’t believe so. The lightness of Janie’s skin may certainly be a factor in Joe’s attraction to Janie, but I don’t really think it’s the only reason. Beyond that, because he is attracted to her, he wants to “raise her above other women”. So, it certainly is a part of it, but it isn’t the only reason. I don’t think Joe is so shallow (at least when he first meets Janie) as to only love her for her appearance.
ReplyDeleteRight now, I am at the part right after Tea Cake wins back all of Janie's money gambling. So far, Tea Cake seems like one of the only truly good main characters. He always does what he says he's going to do, and he is the only man in the book that treats Janie like an equal and lets her do what she wants to do. When he first meets her, he teaches her to play checkers, which none of the other men would ever think of doing. When Janie says that nobody ever taught her to play, Tea Cake responds by saying, "Dis is de last day for dat excuse" (95). Janie is clearly delighted by this: "He set it up and began to show her and she found herself glowing inside. Somebody wanted her to play. Somebody thought it natural for her to play" (95-96). Tea Cake is the first man to let Janie be herself around him, as both her previous husbands imposed their own image of Janie upon her. Also, every time it seems like Tea Cake has done something bad to Janie, he always comes back and makes everything alright. When they are still in Eatonville, Tea Cake leaves to go to his job, and doesn't return for several days, plaguing Janie's mind with doubt. But he does return, reassuring Janie that he truly loves her. Then, in Jacksonville, she wakes up to find him, and her money, gone. Janie soon begins to worry, but the next morning, Tea Cake shows up again, and then gets Janie's money back.
ReplyDeleteHi this is Ami, I wanted to talk about Tea Cake. When Tea Cake is first introduced to Janie, he is sweet and youthful and helps her to believe in love again and so I thought that he was great for her. After they get married though, there are many things that Tea Cake did or said that struck me as strange. For example, after they are married, Janie wakes up and finds that Tea Cake is gone along with all her money. After waiting all day, Tea Cake returns and she finds that he had not only taken all of it, but also spent most of it on a party that he did not invite her to. Another thing that stuck out to me was when Tea Cake beat Janie and he is talking about it with his friend. His friend says, “Tea Cake, you sho is a lucky man.. Uh person can see every place you hit her… Lawd! Wouldn’t Ah love tuh whip uh tender woman lak Janie! Ah bet she don’t een holler. She jus’ cries, eh Tea Cake?” and then later Tea Cake says, “Ah didn’t whu Janie ‘cause she done nothin’. Ah beat her tuh show dem Turners who is boss”(148).
ReplyDeleteWhat I find weird about these situations is that they are ones that I’d expect Janie to fight against or fight back to, but instead, when Tea Cake comes back and explains that he had a party but he’ll give her the money back she just forgives him. And when he beats her for the first time, she mentions nothing of it, and just throughout the book she almost believes that he walks on water. Tea Cake makes Janie happy because he’s helped her to know love but there are many instances where things he did to Janie just felt off, or wrong.
Many people here have been talking about Tea Cake. I find him to be a very strange person. It almost seems to me that he is right on the line between a "good guy" and a "bad guy". He is good enough that the reader trusts him, and sees that he has good intentions, but we also see his bad side when he does things like take all of her money and throw a party, or beat her. I think that some of the reason we see him in a better light is because we have already been presented with two other characters, neither of which were very good to Janie, so when Tea Cake is introduced, love is involved where it hasn't been before, so this biases our opinion toward the "best" out of the three. While Tea Cake was the "best" of the options presented in the book, I still think that Janie could have found a nice man with a steady job that was willing to settle in one place, and have a comfortable life together.
ReplyDeleteSop-de-Bottom
ReplyDeleteSop-de-Bottom is a man who lives and works on the muck. He is a good friend of Tea Cake’s, and likes to gamble and play cards (134-135). He comes to Janie’s trial in the hopes of testifying against her, but afterward, he apologizes (190). Sop is one of the people who survives the hurricane (173), and he attends Tea Cake’s funeral. He also visits Tea Cake when he is sick. These examples show how close Sop-de-Bottom and Tea Cake really were.
To expand on Sarah’s point about Sop-de-bottom; his reason for testifying against Janie during her trial about killing the mad Tea Cake, was purely out of dedication to Tea Cake. “Sop and his friends had tried to hurt her but she knew it was because they loved Tea Cake and didn’t understand. (189)” When he realized that Janie was defending herself and meant only to put Tea Cake out of his misery, he apologized and wanted to remain friends with Janie. Yes Sop-de-bottom was a dedicated and good friend of Tea Cake and his side taking during the trial was an example of how much he cared about him.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI actually agree with What Ami said about Tea Cake's personality and behaviors before and after their marriage. It's kind of funny how he actually made me feel secured for Janie's future in the beginning. He seemed like the person who actually knew what love was or more like he badly wanted to experience it. In doing so he convinces Janie that he is not like any other man and that she's the key to his kingdom. It's also interesting that he never mentions her husband in any of their conversations. I'm pretty sure he knew about the her husbands death one way or the other but he never mentions him in way to secure his love for her. All of this seemed believable at least in my perspective till they got married and they went to Jacksonville. Everything seem to go down and unexpected things happened so suddenly that it was clear tea cake was not whom he said he was in the beginning. I guess it's kind of sad because I could definitely see that he was about to leave her sooner or later. As a result, when I kept reading the first incident accured when tea cake took janie's two hundred dollars to go party. Not only did he party for the whole day but he spends all the money pretty much, only left with twelve dollars. He returns home and tells her what he had done with the money. For some reason I don't know why Janie does not get angry about it. She simply just forgets about it. As if all those thoughts of her regret to have married him were nothing to concerned of.
ReplyDeleteI mean I know that he's gone leave because of the book's intro but it's kind of sucks to actually read how things went down for Janie. Sad story indeed.
peace,
I feel like Tea Cake has a sort of immature streak. He is younger than his predecessors both physically and in habit. He has an energy that Janie's other husbands do not. He isn't restrictive like Joe or Logan. However, Tea Cake is not as responsible. he spends Janie's money without telling her(122), and his plan to get the money back is to gamble for it. he wins, but gets stabbed in the process.
ReplyDeleteI agree with the two posts above. One thing I want to ask, is do people think that Janie would have chosen Tea Cake over Joe Starks even if Joe wasn't dead? I was just questioning this, because I was thinking once again about Janie's very short attention span when it comes to lovers. Nobody's perfect in this book. What a surprise.
ReplyDeleteIn Aaron’s first post here, he says that “Janie previously experiences relationships with people who are very cruel to her because they are men who live in the time period, meaning that men make a living while women deal with the house and a possible family.” I wanted to add on that while it is the time period that influences these men to act like this, it’s also the personality of the men. For example, Logan and Jody are both very cold and rude to Janie, even sexist at times. But Tea Cake respects Janie for who she is. I see this a point that while social standards played a large role in the decision on how women should be treated, it also is on each person separately as to whether the want to follow that or not.
ReplyDeleteWhen I first started the novel, I have to admit; I was not a fan of the main character, Janie. Particularly when she was near the end of her first husbands marriage. She seemed, quite frankly, lazy, to me. Logan asked for her help out in the field and she said it was not her place; that just sounds like an excuse to me. I think she left Logan on a selfish whim and got her karma when she realized that Joe was not the man she thought he was.
ReplyDelete-Annie
On the contrary, I think Janie was punishing Logan for treating her in a sexist manner (like insisting that dinner be ready for him when he wants/expects it) by behaving in that manner when he wants her to do other things. Janie is just rebelling in a passive-aggressive way.
ReplyDeleteSophie S:
ReplyDeleteTea cake plays a highly important role in the novel in creating permanent strength in Janie but he is also very dispensable as the readers are shown later in the novel. Not only does he serve as a catalyst to accelerate Janie’s spiritual growth but also he pushes her towards her goals but also he instills in her the true development of her independence; as shown at the end of the novel after his death she is still strong and willing to preserve. However, language is one of the main themes that Zora Neale Hurston uses to convey many messages during this novel. The language that took place between Janie and Tea Cake was never the less examples of Hurston’s great work. She causes Tea Cake to speak like Janie speaks giving their relationship deeper meaning. Their relationship and love is what the reader sees on the surface but Hurston shows Tea Cake’s deep respect for Janie by the way he talks with her. He does have flaws because he did beat her and steel from her in the novel but his respect for her and love for her overcomes this. He helps her to understand herself and when she first met him under the pear tree she knew that the only way to find out about her and him was through love but her motives became clear to her when she shot Tea Cake herself. I think it’s interesting when one lover kills another because the reader knows that there has to be so much greater meaning to this than a random character. Because Janie shoots teacake it’s not only sad but ironic because Tea Cake showed her how to shoot a gun in the first place. Janie’s decision was to save her rather than live her life with a man, who is kind of neurotic, yet in love with her.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteSophie S.,
ReplyDeleteI agree with you that Tea Cake instills great independence in Janie and allows her lots of freedom. I also agree with you that although he does steal from her and also hits her, his love surmounts both actions. After stealing from her, his main objective is to win everything back and puts himself in a dangerous situation for her. Also, the reason he hits her is out of his love, which doesn't exactly make it right, however, during this setting it makes more sense as he does it to protect and assure his love for her.
Janie goes through many changes throughout the novel and one of the changes is the reader’s view of her as girl in the beginning of the novel to women by the end of the novel, or the end of her first marriage. Janie becomes a woman to herself first in the novel when she gets married but after that fails; she realizes that she still has more emotional growth to take on. “The familiar people and things had failed her so she hung over the gate and looked up the road towards way off. She knew now that marriage did not make love. Janie’s first dream was dead, so she became women” (25). She became women at the end of her first marriage. Then when she met Tea Cake, he took the Janie’s distraught soul and created a powerful and independent woman who knows her place and her actions. The reader also sees a change in Janie’s language after the end of her first marriage where she sounds better mannered and less like an innocent child.
ReplyDeleteI view Janie as a dreamer she comes back in the beginning of the novel beautiful and wanted yet innocent. When Nanny marries her off, she is not happy she wants more in life. She always wants the kind of gushy romance that is poetic. She was to experience her life filtered through romantic love. This is what she gets when she marries Tea Cake. He “talks to her in poems” and truly respects her. The respect of their marriage is the part that evidentially made it the best marriage until she decides yet again that he is not good enough because he taught her to be stronger and more independent. Therefore, she shoots and kills him.
ReplyDeleteThis post was from a little bit ago, but I agree with Ben. He says that Joe Starks is someone who kind of represents a choice more than the one she was offered from her grandma. I think this is true. Before, her grandma just forced the marriage between Logan and Janie to happen. Because a man is making her feel flattered and more special than Logan is, she feels that she finally has an opportunity to do something on her own, so she jumps on the chance to control her life, even though she doesn't know Joe very well.
ReplyDeleteIn response to what Abraham said a few days ago, I think that part of the reason that Janie forgives Tea Cake for taking and spending her money so quickly is because she was so afraid that she had been tricked into loving and trusting someone who might just take her money and run. She was terrified that she had been abandoned so when he returned to her she didn’t really care that he had done something wrong. In the time he was gone she was insecure and imagined that he could only love her money because she was older. She was so relieved that he came back that she never even thought of his actions as a reason to not trust him. Just his coming home to her restored some of her confidence and self-respect. Luckily he does seem to remain trustworthy from this point on.
ReplyDeleteIn response to Sophie S. (Play On Words):
ReplyDeleteI agree, in Janie's younger years it is very fair to say she is a 'dreamer,' from her naivete. She is not happy in her marriage since it's to an old fart(pardon me), and compatibility doesn't just fall out of the sky. Tea Cake and Janie worked the best because they actually had a relationship, where as her other marriages happened on impulse. Impulse doesn't necessarily mean that it was 'her' choice either; considering one was not expected to go downhill after leaving(in Jungian terms listening to her Id), and the other was an arranged marriage.
"The respect of their marriage is the part that evidently made it the best marriage until she decides yet again that he is not good enough because he taught her to be stronger and more independent. Therefore, she shoots and kills him. "
I completely. . . yet respectfully, disagree. She had to kill him otherwise he would have killed her, or he would have died miserably. In war, the sentiment is "kill or be killed." Plus if Janie just let him go rampaging Florida, there would be a rabies outbreak/possible massive population decrease. Then this book would turn into one of those movies were there's an isolated town with a virus that makes them all psychopathic killers foaming out the mouth. Not really want the author intended, and those movies are all the same. . . .
She loved him dearly and did not want to lose him. "Janie held his head tightly in her breast and wept and thanked him for the loving service"(184).
Although, she was going to lose him anyway since he was so sick; it was a service putting him out of his misery. If Tea Cake wasn't sick he wouldn't try to kill her anyway, but he is blinded by the affliction. It was smart of her to kill him, it was an advantage to the common good of this books' "world."
--Aleia
". . . he is not good enough because he taught her to be stronger and more independent. Therefore, she shoots and kills him."
ReplyDeleteJanie also really loved how Tea Cake treated her like an equal. I do not recall her ever thinking a woman has a certain place as a weak, dependent being. In fact the whole point of the book is that she's the opposite of the stereotypical woman for that era. She is already an incredibly strong woman, especially after her difficult relationship with Joe Starks. She may have been -able- to kill him with since she is a strong, independent woman, mixed with the adrenaline factor that someone was about to kill her. I put emphasis on the fact that out of all her suitors in this book, Tea Cake is "the one." If anything she did not kill him for silly, malicious, and half-baked reasons.
--Aleia
I agree with Erica's comment. Janie was afraid of ending up like Anne Tyler "She was broken and her pride gone..." (119) She put herself in the same situation as Anne and was expecting the worst, but luckily, Tea Cake returned. That made her trust him even more.
ReplyDeleteLogan Killicks:
ReplyDeleteLogan Killicks is Janie's first husband. Janie is forced to marry Logan by her grandmother for her "safety" which is in the first place not a good way to start a relationship. Hurston describes him as being old and ugly, especially in comparison to Janie's youthful beauty. He and Janie's relationship encompasses almost no elements of affection or love at all. Logan thinks that marriage means the domination and control of a woman, and as free spirited as Janie is this does not always end well(usually in fights). At the beginning of their marriage Janie actually is completely happy with her treatment, she even mentions it to her friend Pheoby(correct spelling YAY), however towards the end she says she is treated more like an animal than a wife. Logan feels that because she lives with him on 60 acres of land he should do half the work to earn the right to stay there so he tries to get her to do tons of labor.
Logan is not known for being very good with words and often does not show his emotions effectively. This ultimately ends their marriage because Janie threatens to leave him and he responds completely horribly to Janie's threat and brushes it off in such a way that she feels she is of no value to him. She then elopes with her second husband; Jodie Starks.
In Zora Neale Hurston’s novel "Their Eyes Were Watching God," Hurston created a character named Mrs. Turner. Mrs. Turner is an African American who discriminates against people of her own race if she has lighter skin than they do. I believe this character was created because the heroine of the story, Janie, faces many styles of discrimination based on her appearance. And with this character, Hurston shows us even one more example of how narrow minded people can be, too often judging people by their appearance.
ReplyDeleteSince Janie has a light complexion, Mrs. Turner seeks her as a friend, thinking that light skinned African Americans should stick together. Janie gives no encouragement to Miss Turner and is sometimes a little rude to her so she will leave her alone as she is mean to her husband, Tea Cake. But Miss Turner thinks that because Janie has lighter skin that she is merely putting Miss Turner in her place when she acts rude. Hurston writes, “Anyone who looked more white folkish than herself was better than she was in her criteria, therefore it was right that they should be cruel to her at times.” (page 144) Hurston wrote this so we can better understand how blind Mrs. Turner is.
(Riley Winograd)
This is a response to Riley's comment. I think you summed up Mrs. Turners character really well, and I agree with your description about her personality and the way she discriminates. I think you brought up a good point. That point being that Janie's character faces a lot of discrimination based on the way she looks. I think it was interesting how Hurston chose to show that as an example of how close minded people can be. But I also think it gave a very big message to the readers of this novel.
ReplyDeleteI just wanted to give my opinion on Janie's marriages and the role of sexism in all 3. I think this was said I while back in the posts, but I think that personality plays a larger role than sexism in how Janie's husbands treat her. For example, I don't think her first husband was an entirely bad person, or horribly sexist either. Yes, he does order Janie to make him meals and such, but when he asks her to help out in the field, Janie is in fact the one conforming to sexist values as she refuses to help, as the fields were not often considered a place for women to work. Jodie on the other hand was relentlessly sexist. From stating that women had no brains to generally bossing Janie around, Jodie's mean streak seemed to show up primarily in a sexist manner. Had Jodie not been sexist at all, I think he would still be bossy, overbearing, and an overall bad match for Janie.
ReplyDeleteWhile Jodie is an unlikeable person even underneath his sexist tendancies, Tea Cake is a good person under his rare sexist acts. The only instance of sexism in Tea Cake and Janie's marriage (so far-I haven't finished the novel quite yet) is Tea Cake's whipping of Janie at the threat of Mrs.Turner's brother coming as a suitor. Even then, Tea Cake admits to his disliking of the practice. It seems as though he felt he had to, simply because it was "customary", and because he had to display his dominance. Otherwise, Tea Cake is very respectful of Janie's free nature and rarely or never shows signs of dominance or misogyny.
Joe
ReplyDeleteAt first, Joe seemed like a nice person to Janie, someone who will treat her right. He is rich and handsome, but he is also domineering and proud, something she finds out fairly quickly. He walks into a town, turns it on its head by buying things left and right, and becomes the mayor. At first he is loved by the town, but he soon shows his true colors to them too, mainly with the state of his house. "[the house] had two stories with porches, with bannisters and such things. The rest of the town looked like servants' quarters surrounding the 'big house.' And different from everybody else in the town he put off moving in until it had been painted, in and out. And look at the way he painted it-a gloaty, sparkly white. The kind of promenading white that the houses of Bishop Whipple, W.B. Jackson and the Vanderpool's wore." He flaunts his riches in everyone's faces, and makes everyone else do menial chores, almost like slaves, while he does the easy, or less physical, work or "supervises." These actions alienate him from the townspeople, and forcing Janie to work and refusing to let her sit and be a real person and gossip like everyone else alienates him from Janie. He turns her into a possession, like some sort of walking deity, second only to him. He is a sort of intimidating person, though no one knows exactly why. This is why no one crosses him, even though they are resentful.
However, when Joe grows older and weaker, this intimidation factor becomes more like a bunch of empty threats. He is all talk and no substance, and he knows this. This insecurity makes him beat up on Janie, both physically and verbally. He reminds me of the Wizard of Oz, a weak, ordinary humbug hidden behind a curtain and a bunch of scary-looking machinery that people idolize (though in Joe's case the curtain is riches and the machinery is power). No one really knows about the man behind the curtain, they only revere the fake person in front of him. This is the same with Joe until Janie, fed up with his taunts, pulls back the curtain for everyone to pity. They still fear and respect the machinery, but they pity the actual person behind it. This ruins the final years of their marriage, as Joe tries to find any way to make Janie completely and utterly regretful of what she did, and to try and piece his pride back together. Even on his deathbed, he is a pretender, a false identity made to conceal the real one, trying to strip Janie of her pride in the way she did his.
Throughout most of the book, and therefore a lot of Janie’s recorded life, she stood back and was a bystander, sort of along for the ride except for rare occasions with her husbands. During much of Janie’s teen-age life, before her first marriage, Janie’s grandmother controlled her actions and decisions. For instance, Janie had no choice about when or whom she would marry. Throughout her first marriage Janie was pushed around by her husband and lived a confined life. Even though she eventually took control of her life by running off with Joe Starks, the escape and destination were planned solely by Joe. In a way it was more of Joe running off with Janie than the other way around. Then, Joe took charge of her life for the next seventeen years until his death by making her work and dress as he told her. After Joe’s death she decided not to tolerate any guys flirting with her, with the exception of Tea Cake. That decision, and when Janie decided to run off and marry Tea Cake are examples of when she finally seized control of her life. That changed when one morning Tea Cake walked off with a large amount of her money and returned a few days later with merely anything. Janie forgave him and they continued their marriage (another example of her being a bystander). When Tea Cake took her to the Everglades she made some decisions for herself about whom to talk to and when she would go to work in the field. However, the focus of the book turned towards Tea Cake. At one point, as caravans of Native Americans were fleeing the everglades from an unseen hurricane, he told Janie to stay with him and not flee. Against her better judgment, she stayed with him and they barely survive the hurricane. The next time she made a big decision was when she pulled the trigger of a gun on the rabid Tea Cake and returned to her old home with Joe Starks. For the most part, in Their Eyes Were Watching God Janie was riding the coat tails of her husband at the time, and rarely made decisions for her self.
ReplyDeleteHi. This is Mickey. After reading this book, I'm just wondering if we're meant to like any of the characters except maybe Tea Cake. Janie is horrible to Logan who had many faults, but definitely didn't deserve to be played like he was by her and even her grandmother who knew she didn't want him but made both Logan and Janie believe that Janie did, or at least would want him. Her grandmother forced her into a marriage not for her happiness, but for her supposed "safety" which her grandmother only cares about for her own piece-of-mind. Joe is just really troubled and let's it out on Janie because he's sexist and she's the best thing he can find to be mad at. I mean, even Tea Cake ends up hitting her. Who in this book is actually likable? This book may be more realistic than the Plot Discussion is giving it credit for.
ReplyDeleteI'm amazed at the way that Joe Starks gets everyone to obey him. One second they all think he's crazy, and the next second they all are craving his approval and are practically paying him to let them do stuff for him. Then again, maybe they just respect the way that he can see potential in this small not-quite-town, or they at least want to believe what he says because it could mean that their lives might get more interesting.
ReplyDeleteBen Abbott 8/29/11 (this post contains information from the article "A Profeminist Postcard From Haiti" at the back of the book")
ReplyDeleteBefore she wrote "Their Eyes Were Watching God" Zora Neale Hurston had a relationship with a man she referred to as "the real love affair of her life". It ended because he wanted her to give up her career, marry him, and leave New York. "I really wanted to do anything he wanted me to do, but that one thing I could not do," she wrote. I believe that the Janie's relationships throughout the book are inspired by Hurston's own. Janie and Jody's relationship represents what Hurston feared what would happen if she accepted her lover's offer; while Janie and Tea Cake's relationship represents her relationship while it lasted, when she was happy.
I believe the characters are also modeled after her lover. Tea Cake is what her lover was was and Jody was what she was afraid he would become. I find these details to be interesting because they illuminate one of the ways she gets inspiration for her characters and plot. I like the idea of Hurston putting her own feelings and experiences in to her book, it makes it much more easy to visualize the scenes and sympathize with the characters.
As we all know, Janie’s first two marriages did not end well for her. She was unhappy with Logan Killicks and left to marry Joe Starks. Then she became unhappy again because of her lack of freedom, but after Joe died, she finally decided to live her life the way she wanted to: “Ah done lived Grandma’s way, now Ah means tuh live mine.” (114) She says this to Pheoby when she was being questioned about whether she was really going to marry Tea Cake. She married Logan because she wanted to make her grandma happy, but then she married Joe with the same thoughts in mind. Joe was rich and looked influential so Janie convinced herself that it would be ok to marry him. Although it looked like she married him for herself, but she actually had her grandma in mind when she did, which is part of the reason the marriage didn’t go so well. Then when she met Tea Cake, he was pretty much the opposite of what her grandma wanted for her so she felt freedom (or maybe like a rebel) when she did. She was finally living the way she wanted.
ReplyDeleteTo respond to Christopher's post:
ReplyDeleteI totally agree and thank you for elaborating on my post. I think Sop is a very interesting character with a lot more to him then we get to learn about. Some things that aren't explicitly stated but can be assumed about him are:
1. He is very dedicated to his friends, as shown when he went to Janie's trial.
2. When he realizes that something he did was wrong, he tries to fix it.
I think it would have been nice to see more of Sop-de-Bottom's personality than we did, because that would help me understand and relate to the character.
Throughout the novel speech, in the forms of storytelling and conversation, is used as a means for the characters to validate themselves and their experiences. It is through their words that they gain the recognition of their peers, and in gaining this recognition can see for themselves the value of their own life. It is for this reason that the townspeople gossip about Janie when she comes home without Tea Cake, and Sam, Lige and Walter ridicule Matt for the pitiful state of his mule – they are making themselves known to their fellows, and in doing so living their life in a way that leaves them, at least temporarily, fulfilled. The power and importance of speech and the connections it forges between people are, however, shown much more acutely in Janie’s lack of any meaningful relationships while under the influence of her second husband Joe Starks. As Hurston herself points out, when talking and trading their stories on the porch of the store, the towns folk “are the center of the world” (64). At certain points Janie manages to break through the confines of her husband and laugh with the rest of the townspeople but Joe always manages to ruin it for her in his efforts to “[pour] honor all over her; [and build] a high chair for her to sit in and overlook the world” (62). In Joe’s attempts to pamper Janie, and give her all he thinks she wants, he isolates her from the rest of their neighbors by making her untouchable to anyone she might want to associate with. It is speech and conversation that forge the heart of any relationship, so in denying Janie the chance to interact with the other townspeople, he essentially takes away that which the others seem to live for – the feeling of human companionship.
ReplyDeleteHi Rose:)
ReplyDeleteI agree with you completely because communication is vital to any relationship. When Janie was put on the a pedal stool and labeled as the "bell cow" Joe had taken away connections between her and others. This took away her right to explain and earn herself a name. Even their marriage began to fall apart as they moved farther away from one another. She learned hush up and roll with the punches but it only took away what little connection they had left.
Its very sad how people always make assumptions and stick with them until they are set straight. Fortunately, Janie was given a chance to validate herself, as you'd say, and make those accusers swallow their words.
Thats what i was thinking after reading your post:)
Nazshonnii
I saw the storytelling more as a means of passing time, or coping with the boredom of normal life. For example, after Joe bought Sam's mule, Hurston writes, "Anyhow a free mule in town was something to talk about" (58). But looking at the mule's funeral, I can see how the characters also use stories to establish themselves: "Starks led off with a great eulogy on our departed citizen… and the people loved the speech. It made him more solid than building the schoolhouse had done" (60).
ReplyDeleteJoe Starks and Tea Cake:
ReplyDeleteJoe was not impulsive, he had a goal from when he was first introduced and he worked and planned toward accomplishing that goal. He was not and emotional man either, he showed his initial affection for Janie with tangible items he bought for her. His main desire was control of Janie, the town, and all elements of his life. Joe wanted control, and planned and used his instinctive knowledge of people and charisma to achieve his goals.
Tea Cake is very impulsive and emotionally driven. His life is run by whims and passions, which is part of what leads Janie to fall in love with him, his freedom and sense of fun. Tea Cake's skills include gambling, which he is very good at and seems to do instinctively. He thrives on socializing, he loves a large group of people and a party, which he creates on a whim his first day of marriage to Janie. Tea Cake lives freely, instinctively, and with few worries.
The similarity I see between the two is charisma and knowledge of peoples' emotions. Joe intentionally used this skill, and Tea Cake uses it more unconsciously, but they both have it.
I’d like to comment on Baeo’s remark (on August 2nd) about Janie acting somewhat childishly when arguing with Joe. I do agree that with that remark she takes up a tone similar to a petulant child, but one has to remember how young she still is at that point in the story. She is still in her late teens at this point, still young, impressionable, and, yes, insecure. While her insecurity might seem out of place later in the story, at this point she has recently been married twice and is coming to terms with the fact that her second marriage may not be so much better than the last. At this point in the story I think it’s completely natural for Janie to be uncertain about any number of things going on in her life.
ReplyDeleteI find it interesting that on page 32, when Janie and Joe run off from her marriage at the time they are accepted into the new town, with open arms, yet when Janie runs off with Tea Cake after Joe’s death she is disapproved by the people of the town. Janie and Joe ditched Janie’s first husband while he was still alive and kicking. True, not everyone in the town they arrive at knew about Janie and Joe’s past, but surely someone found out and spread the word. Still they may not have known that Janie’s ex-husband was cruel and controlling, for all they knew he could have been perfectly nice guy, but just not exciting enough for Janie. Despite this they never question Janie and Joe’s honor. Eventually when Joe died Janie played widow for a while but then met Tea Cake. After getting to know Tea Cake, Janie decided to go start a new life with him. In the eyes of the towns’ people this action was strongly disapproved and discussed, they said “… Joe Starks had been dead but nine months and here she goes sashaying off to a picnic in pink linen… poor Joe Starks. Bet he turns over in his grave every day… (page 110).” For me, I find this transition to a new relationship by Janie to be more honorable than the previous (not to say I disapprove of either). This is because Joe Starks was dead and was in no place to worry about who his wife was gallivanting off with, unlike Janie’s other ex-husband. Still, what interests me is the reaction of the town to both Janie and Joe running off from Janie’s living, breathing first husband in comparison to Janie and Tea Cake getting together after the death of her second husband, Joe Starks.
ReplyDeleteIn response to Brenden, I think one reason that her relationship with Joe Starks was accepted and her relationship with Tea Cake wasn't was that no one in Eatonville had known Janie before she came there with Joe, and because of his controlling attitude, the townsfolk came to know Janie as The Mayor's Wife. Even after Joe died, they still thought of her as his wife, so when she ran off with Tea Cake, that contradicted everything they thought about her. When Janie and Tea Cake moved to Jacksonville and then the Everglades, they were accepted as a married couple.
ReplyDeleteTea Cake is the sweetest guy in Their Eyes Were Watching God. He is cheerful, honest, humorous, ambitious (to a degree), and he plays the guitar. Before Tea Cake, Janie didn't know the kind care she deserves. He allows her to express herself, to have fun, and to have a say in things. He truly sees her as a person and not as a device.
ReplyDeleteOne example that shows how privileged Janie is in being with Tea Cake is shown when Tea Cake returns home after she’s been worrying over him being gone for a long time. He says “Don’t need tuh ast me where Ah been all dis time, ‘cause it’s mah all day job tuh tell yuh” (121). This is how Tea Cake is different than Janie’s previous husbands: he knows he has responsibility in their relationship, and furthermore, he volunteers for it.
Another detail that shows how meaningful their relationship is to Janie is how she allows herself to express her emotions to him. He manages to win her heart, and as a result, as the book puts it, “her soul crawled out from its hiding place” (128).
Something I found interesting in this novel is how Janie stifles herself during her marriage to Joe. I totally understand how, given Joe's continued smackdowns of her attempts at pretty much anything, she would withdraw and become meek and submissive (as she did) but what strikes me especially is that within the 17 years of their marriage, there are only a few - maybe three or four - given instances of her speaking out against him or for herself. Considering Janie's natural gumption and the generally positive responses she received when she did speak for herself, what surprises me is how completely she shut herself down. We read some examples of her expressing herself, like here, when a bunch of men are sitting on the porch talking and she "thrust herself into the conversation. 'Sometimes God gits familiar wid us womenfolks too and talks His inside business. He told me how surprised He was 'bout y'all turning out so smart after Him makin' yuh diferent; and how surprised y'all is goin' tuh be if you ever find out you don't know how half as much 'bout us as you think you do. It's so easy to make yo'self out God Almighty when you ain't got nothin' tuh strain against but women and chickens'" (75). (Naturally Joe quickly chastises her and sends her back inside.) Short speeches like this give us a great insight into what Janie's thinking when she doesn't outwardly express herself, as she had done for so long before marrying Joe.
ReplyDeleteIn this post I want to talk about gender equality and how the characters deal with it. Specifically, what Janie wants and what she gets in her relationships with both Logan and Joe. In her first relationship, though abusive, was actually rather equal in terms of the man and the woman doing the same work and neither constricted to, say, only working a specific job like cooking and cleaning. But it actually seems like Janie likes to play cleaner/cook rather than to out-door physical labor, as seen in this quote: “You don’t need my help out dere, Logan. Youse in yo’ place and Ah’m in mine.” (31). This may have been part of the reason she left; she certainly wants a place where she can be very “womanly”. When Joe sweeps her off her feet,he promises that she will be treated like a woman, which is what she really wants, but when she is set in charge of the store, she hates it, say quote; “The store itself was a pleasant place if only she didn’t have to sell things.”(51). Frankly, she seems like a very lazy person, and she dislikes any responsibility, content with cooking and cleaning. Janie is almost the opposite of the classic strong female character in that respect.
ReplyDeleteI would like to start a discussion about Matt Bonner's yellow mule. Although the mule itself is not much of a character, and all we hear about him is that he has a mean temper and is far too thin, his presence in the novel provides a substantial role. To the townspeople, the mule is a way to pass the time, providing means to tease Matt and an animal to bait. To the reader, the mule demonstrates the sense of community amongst the townspeople, excluding Matt, and shows their humor and the environment that they live in. Hurston writes, "Everybody indulged in mule talk. He was next to the Mayor in prominence, and made better talking" (53). In addition, the mule illustrated the growing difference between who Joe wanted Janie be and who she was; "Janie loved the conversation and sometimes thought up good stories on the mule, but Joe had forbidden her to indulge" (53). Janie wants to be a member of the community Joe has brought her too, but he wants her to act as if she's above it, as he does not want those associated with him to be common, for the sake of his own image. Eventually, however, the mule shows that there is a gap forming even between Janie and the community she longs to join; "Everybody was having fun at the mule-baiting. All but Janie. She snatched her head away from the spectacle and began muttering to herself. 'They oughta be shamed uh theyselves! Teasing' dat poor brute beast lak they is! Done been worked to death; done had his disposition ruint wid mistreatment, and now they got tuh finish devilin' 'im tuh death. Wisht Ah had mah way wid 'em ali'" (56). The men on the porch are having a good deal of fun messing with the mule, but Janie finds it distasteful. The mule's death and dragging further distance Janie from both Joe and the town. He tells her, "Why, Janie! You wouldn't be seen at uh draggin'-out, wouldja?" (60). Once again, Joe forces her into his harsh expectations of her to suit his image of himself as Mayor. Later, Hurston writes, "[T]he carcass moved off with the town, and left Janie standing in the doorway" (60). Janie has become an outcast from those who surround her. She is distant from Joe because she has no love for the woman he wants her to be, and she is distant for the town because they see the woman Joe wants her to be. In that moment, Joe and the town leave her behind. After the dragging out, there is never any sign of affection between Janie and Joe, only fighting, bickering, and disagreement, until Janie leaves him. This is a pivotal point in their relationship.
ReplyDeleteJoe Starks seems to be an extremely influential character, and seems to be a quite driven individual. He is able to easily convince Janie to run away with him to an unknown to her future simply on his word that he will treat her well. He is extremely driven to have this influence over a large group of people, so he raises money and comes to the small black town of Eatonville that is getting set up. He does this so that he can be a real leader, unlike his position in the majoritively white towns. Once he gets to this new town, he instantly takes on a huge role in the advancement of the town, from buying a huge amount of land for it, to starting up a store and post office in it, to erecting a street lamp. He wishes to make this a civilized town, much like white peoples towns, but ruled completely by black people, with him as the mayor. He uses all of these things as opportunities to gain respect and power, quickly becoming the mayor of the town. He seems to quickly become extremely drunk on power. It seems that he was so frustrated about having to be a second class citizen that when he tried to create this new society that would be more fair and even towards blacks, to make up for the previous unfairness in his life, he turned around and took the white peoples position of power. It doesn’t even seem though that the power corrupted him, but more that his plan all along was to gain ultimate power in this town. This seems to basically be Joe Starks only goal. His philosophies in general seem to be hypocritical to me. He wanted power that he frustratingly could not have because of his position as a second class citizen in the white towns, so instead of trying to stop this unfairness, he subjects others to it. Even his relationship with Janie seems to be based off of hypocritical ideals. He seems to be against racism, but still seems to follow many sexist ideals. His ideas of treating Janie right seem to be very sexist. Because she’s a woman she is weaker than men, and thus can’t partake in many of the conversations, or can’t go to things like the dragging of the mule out of town. She basically has to e pampered and protected. This is basically the extreme opposite of Logan killicks views that Janie should work really hard out in the field all day. Also, he believes that because she is the mayor’s wife, she has to be extremely restrained to hold up their higher class position, which seems to be extremely frustrating to her too.
ReplyDeleteTea Cake (Vergible Woods):
ReplyDeleteTea Cake is Janie's third husband. Janie meets Tea Cake when working in Eatonville's general store(after the death of Jodie), he is described as a younger man and has a certain quality to him which makes him instantly interesting. He is very charming. Tea Cake ensnares Janie's attention as soon as she meets him. He comes into the general store and teaches her how to play checkers; This is in such contrast to Jodie that it surprises her, Tea Cake is actually treating her like a human being and a woman. And thus comes the reason why he is so influential in this story, he is the first husband to actually treat her like how she thought a woman should be treated. He is respectful to her and allows her to develop and fulfill the "pear tree" metaphor that has been in her mind for years that she has always yearned for. She develops romantically and spiritually in the short year+some she has with Tea Cake before he dies as an indirect result of trying to save her. Tea Cake is an extremely important character because he helps catalyze the reaction of hear developing as a person.
(Sorry for straggling behind :D)
I want to talk about Phoebe a little bit. Phoebe is one of the very first characters we as the readers meet. Janie is telling Phoebe her life story and though she is an important character, she doesn't come back into the story until much later. When she does, Janie has just met Tea Cake and the townspeople are very disapproving. She is the only person who just warns her of the things that could happen, and she also gives her money to bring just in case anything bad might happen. I think this shows just how good of a friend she is to Janie. No other woman in the story supports Janie in this way, and I think that's important and its a reason why Phoebe is the one being told the story.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Ami; not only is Phoebe the only woman who supports Janie and who does not gossip about her, but she's really one of the only people. I thought it was nice to see that kind of loyalty and friendship, especially after everything Janie has had to endure. Considering Janie has always had fairly negative relationships with the women in her life, her friendship with Phoebe is very refreshing and hopeful.
ReplyDeleteThe only times I had really thought about Pheobes character, was in the beginning, and the end of the novel. I think that Pheobe is a really important person in Janie's life, and it really shows throughout the story. I agree with what Ami said. I agree that the stuff Pheobe does for Janie resembles their friendship, and how good and meaningful it is to both of them.
ReplyDeleteLuke Alexander Fleischman:
ReplyDeleteWhile I agree that Tea Cake is a GREAT character and is a crucial part of Janie's development, i dont think he is the only true good character. I feel like Nanny is also a great character, although she gives up on her own daughter she makes many sacrifices inorder to impart her hopes and dreams for a great life for african american women. And while she pushes Janie into and unloving marriage, she wants her to have support.
Haven and Luke –
ReplyDeleteI think that many of the characters are “truly good”. Although many are not, such as the people of Eatonville or Janie’s past husbands, she has many allies who are truly good to her. I believe that Janie herself if a truly good character, as well as Tea Cake and Nanny. I also agree with Ami, Luci and Naomi that Phoebe is very good to Janie and proves herself to be a truly good person when she supports Janie and does not engage in the towns peoples cruel treatment and judgment of her.
As the novel progressed it was very interesting to see how Janie grew and became her own character. At the start of the novel she found her own personalty, she was able to see that she wanted to be a free spirt. She finds her independence when see makes the discussion to runs away form her first husband, Logan Killicks a older financial secured man, for Jody Sparks, a man that has promises for a more interesting life. For some time her life seem to be what she wants, and seems happy to be the wife of the town mayor. This happiness last for some time till she finds herself in the same position she was in with Logan Killicks, confined and controlled. Jody Sparks set rules and regulations for Janie when she is out in public requiring her to tie up her hair. Unlike her experiences with Logan Killicks she will not run away this time but sticks it out till the death of Jody Sparks. For some time she remains the person that Jody Sparks made her into but eventually there is a change. When a new character, Tea Cake, is introduced into Janie's life she again introduced to freedom.
ReplyDeleteLogan Killicks plays a small part in this book, but also seems to have an effect on Janie as a character. Logan is Janie’s first husband, who she is more or less forced to marry by her grandmother so that she can grow up in a stable and respectable environment. Logan is originally very nice to Janie, but slowly asks her of more and more. Very soon it is to the point that he is forcing her to do work on his farm, and their relationship changes from one of a sweet marriage status to one of him forcing her to do work that she doesn’t want to do on his farm. This put with the fact that he is not the most handsome man, nor the most eloquent, nor the most expressive of his feelings seems to really start to put a separation in their already fragile relationship based off of an arranged marriage. He is not exactly the most likable guy it seems, but still seems to care for Janie, though this is not mutual. Janie says, “Some folks never was meant to be loved and he’s one of ‘em”(24). Then when asked to explain this further she replies: “’Cause Ah hates de way his head is so long one way and so flat on de sides and dat pone uh fat back us his neck…… Ah don’t keer who made it, Ah don’t like de job. His belly is too big too, now, and his toe-nails look lak mule foots”(24). The final straw though seems to be when Janie asks Logan “Sposin’ Ah wuz to run off and leave yuh sometime”(30). Logan responds to her question with “Ah’m getting’ sleepy, Janie. Let’s don’t talk no mo’. ‘Tain’t too many mens would trust yuh, knowin’ yo’ folks lak dey do”(30). And after further questioning he responds “Shucks! ‘Tain’t no mo’ fools lak me. A whole lot of mens will grin in yo’ face, but dey ain’t gwine to work and feed yuh. You won’t git far and you won’t be lond, when dat big gut reach over and grab dat little one, you’ll be too glad to come back here”(30). Firstly he is completely not expressing his feelings constructively, as shown by the following line “He flopped over resentful in his agony and pretended to sleep. He hoped that he had hurt her as she had hurt him”(31). He seems extremely emotionally detached from her with what he said, and this does seem to make Janie feel as if there is no point to keep up their marriage. With what he said, he also seems to be completely trivializing what she’s saying, and is basically saying, I don’t need to worry about you leaving me for someone else, because no one else is ever going to want you. This is extremely insulting, and this seems to get the final response out of her that makes her leave him for Joe.
ReplyDelete-Julian F-T
I would like to talk about Jody Stark. Now earlier in the summer I saw a documentary on prostitution in New York. It was a powerful Documentary, which made you feel. But one thing that stuck was the manipulative power and the hold the pimps had on the girls. At first they were nice for the first couple weeks, but soon over time their attitude did a 180, from nurturing to business. This is what I think of when I think of Jody Stark. The way he was nice to Janie when they first met. He spoke of his dreams, and the uses of his words pried Janies first marriage apart. Though she wasn’t happy in her previous marriage, he made it seem as though he would keep her happy till death. But that all changed once the “honeymoon” was over.
ReplyDeleteStark used and treated Janie like another one of his possessions; he had her keep her hair up, because he felt as though no man could lay their eyes upon her beautiful hair but his own. Not really seeing that Janie loved her hair, and felt strongly against wrapping it up. Her hair was her beauty, power, her freedom. “She tore off the kerchief from her head and let down her plentiful hair” (87). The quote describes Janie breaking free, her hair symbolizes her freedom and the kerchief exemplifies Starks hold on her, which he had no longer.
On another note Stark did good things for Janie and the town, though I felt like he abused his power, and used people like doormats. He took advantage of the town when elected mayor, some were not pleased they felt as though he looked down on them, which was an idea the towns folks and Stark shared. But one thing they didn’t figure out was how they (towns’ people) fed the great beast Stark. They feed him complements like “you’se uh king!” (73) And praising him for his work in the town. Unknowingly it was throwing gas on the fire called his ego. But that power was stripped from him once Janie fought back with her words. Between page 78 and 80. Janie used her words like a fist. She struck her husband down, and with that belittled him and put a damper on the fire we call his ego. Stark was dumb stuck and his only rebuttal was a forceful slap to her face.
I must say that the relationship between Janie and stark was most interesting. I believe that Janie Summed Stark up quite well when she said “you changed everything but nothing’ don’t change you-not even death” (86).
Another Character that i would like to speak of is Nanny.Let me point out how Zora Neal Hurston made Nanny seem important to Janie in the start of the Novel. Once married we here no more of here until Janie met Mr. Stark. Zora portrayed Nanny as a strong rock in Janie’s’ life, rock which gave Janie support, strength, and love. But my thoughts of Nanny being important were shot down when Janie said to Mr. Stark that her grandmother died. I felt as though Janie said it nonchalantly, she said it in passing. I was surprised that the death of her grandmother, was not told in a chapter, but in one sentence.
ReplyDeleteIn response to Aaron
ReplyDeleteOverall I agree with Aaron’s argument that Janie experiences cruelty in her marriages until she meets Tea Cake. However, I do not think that she is as weak as Aaron implies. She does not eventually succumb to Joe’s harsh treatment. On some levels she learns to ignore Joe’s restrictions but that does not mean she accepts them. For example, when Joe is on his deathbed Janie tells him how her life will be better without him. She blames the failures of their relationship on his treatment of her. She would not have said this if she had accepted Joe’s sexism.
In response to Sally
ReplyDeleteI do not think that Janie had “fairy tale” dreams of marriage even before she married Logan. She was already aware that her mother had been raped and this made her expect that marriage would not be easy. Even though Janie was forced to grow up quickly, being married so young and having her spouse chosen by her family was not abnormal in that time and place.
In response to Jalen
ReplyDeleteI didnt even realize that the importance of the grandmother were portrayed in one sentence, but now that i think about it, that's true. The grandmother had this vision or way of life that she wanted Janie to have, and did all that she could to make it happen. Even through all of that Janie didn't follow what her grandmother wanted her to do and married Joe Starks and then later on, Tea Cake. Basically all that the grandmother did for Janie was flushed down the drain when janie didnt speak of her grandmother after she died.
In response to Emma
ReplyDeleteI also agree that there are several other good people. One guy I think wasn't mentioned was her first forced marriage whom her grandmother set her up with. I cant remember the name at the moment but he did love her even though he didnt show all the time. They did have some arguements, but he never harmed her like Joe Starks did. He might not have been "truly good", but he did what he could. Pheobe was her only true friend in Eatonville when it mattered most and the grandmother worked/used her whole life so that Janie could live in ways where other black women wouldn't be able to live.
I agree with Haven, Nanny is a good person and legitimately wants what's best for Janie. She thinks that Janie needs a man with a steady income in order for her to be content. She grew up in a time far different from Janie, and because of that her advice is rather dated. But she most definitely cares for Janie and wants her to be happy.
ReplyDeleteIn response to Jalen and Dwayne, I agree with Dwayne that Nanny, once an important character in the novel and Janie’s life, fell by the waste side when Janie stopped valuing her advice and striving for the life Nanny wanted for her. Once she decided to chase her own dreams Janie thought of Nanny less constantly because she was no longer trying to please her. Had Nanny and Janie’s desires coincided maybe Nanny would have been a bigger part of Janie’s future and therefore the novel.
ReplyDeleteAs Janie ages she moves through different relationships and slowly transitions away from traditional marriages and finally towards more liberating relationships. In her first marriage with Logan she experienced the most abuse. This gave her a clearer idea of what she wanted for herself in the future. She wanted a relationship with more freedom and respect. During her marriage with Joe, she escaped the physical aspects of Logan’s abuse but their dynamics still were not what she pictured a marriage should be. She still wanted the ability to speak her mind freely and to be acknowledged for her thoughts. When Joe died she was not looking for another relationship but instead she was just enjoying an independent woman. Because of this she and Tea Cake were able to have a partnership not based on power.
ReplyDeleteI think Tea Cake is a really interesting character. He has this strange balance of being at times very respectful and at times very disrespectful of Janie. The town seems to be very skeptical of him, and they all warn Janie not to leave with Tea Cake because they feel he will eventually take her money and leave her. It's never really explained, unless I just missed it, why the townspeople are so distrustful of Tea Cake: whether he did something to earn this, or whether they simply have some sort of prejudice against him. I think knowing Tea Cake's back story could have made his relationship with Janie more interesting, but since Hurston didn't really include it we're left to guess at it.
ReplyDeleteIn response to Simone, I got the impression that the reason the town did not approve of her relationship with Tea Cake and didn't trust him was just because the idea of a relationship with a wealthy older woman and a younger less well off man was uncommon. The idea of this relationship was foreign to them. The only real example of this that they had seen was with Mrs. Tyler who ended up robbed and abandoned. The towns people seem to love Tea Cake as a person and only really distrust him in this unusual situation.
ReplyDeleteIn response to Erica, in response to Simone:
ReplyDeleteI agree completely with Erica. I think the reason the town disagreed with Janie and Tea Cake's relationship was because it was different. They didn't like how she was not only older than him, but also had considerably more money than him. I also think that they saw Janie doing a lot of things with him that women in their town usually didn't do, and they didn't like that. Another good point that Erica made is that the only other time they've seen a situation similar to Janie and Tea Cakes was with Mrs. Tyler's marriage, which didn't end well. So I guess it's a mixture of them being protective of Janie and them not liking how different Janie and Tea Cake are compared to what they're used to.
In response to Ami, I completely agree with all the points you made. I furthermore think that the townspeople saw it as a sign of disrespect to their former mayor, Joe, that not much time had passed and Janie was already hanging around a much younger man, and one who was at a much lower level than Joe socially. I think it's also very true that Tea Cake brought out this independent and self-assured side of Janie that the town was not prepared to see from a woman.
ReplyDelete“‘Ah was wid dem white chillun so much till Ah didn’t know Ah wuzn’t white till Ah was round six years old…. Ah looked at de picture a long time and seen it was mah dress and mah hair so Ah said: “Aw, aw! Ah’m colored!” Den dey all laughed real hard. But before Ah seen de picture Ah though Ah wuz just like de rest’” (9).
ReplyDeleteI think this quote is important because it shows the capacity of Janie’s imagination. As a child, she was surrounded by so many white people, the idea that she might be different from them didn’t even enter her mind, and she was shocked to find out through a photograph of herself she saw when she was six years old. Her reaction even bordered upon disappointment, as the first words uttered were “Aw, aw,” this further offering an idea of what it meant to be a colored person in those times.
Further on Janie’s imagination, it truly allowed her to be care-free, and induced a time when she didn’t have to worry about the color of her skin, and how that might affect her life. When true womanhood dawned and she was forced to marry Logan Killicks, a much older man, Janie’s imagination did not leave her, yet it was suppressed. Yet her imagination of what she could be led her to seek more out of life, and so she ran away with Joe Starks. However their relationship did not turn out to be ideal, as her imagination was once again stifled. After Joe passed away, Tea Cake entered Janie’s life and her imagination was once again sparked. Tea Cake allowed this imagination to flourish, and indeed added to it. Combined, they led a beautiful, spontaneous life, and one in which their roles in the relationship were practically equal. Even after Tea Cake’s death, Janie’s imagination is still very much alive, as the book closes with her imagining him there beside her for the rest of her years.
“Joe returned to the store full of pleasure and good humor but he didn’t want Janie to notice it because he saw that she was sullen and he resented that. She had no right to be, the way he thought things out. She wasn’t even appreciative of his efforts and she had plenty cause to be. Here he was just pouring honor all over her; building a high chair for her to sit in and overlook the world and she here pouting over it! Not that he wanted anybody else, but just too many women would be glad to be in her place.” (62)
ReplyDeleteI found this passage very interesting because it shows Joe’s side of his and Janie’s relationship while most of the narrative follows Janie’s side. Janie feels that Joe doesn’t give her enough freedom and she doesn’t like how he tries to tell her what to do all the time. I do not think that she is ungrateful of everything that he gives her but doesn’t think that it gives him the right to boss her around and be rude to her. Joe on the other hand thinks exactly the opposite. He doesn’t think twice whether or not he should be able to boss around his wife and giving her ‘honor” gives him even more right to have power over her. He thinks that not only should she be obedient but constantly appreciative as well. Because of this misunderstanding they both resent each other. We also see in this passage that contrary to what Janie often thinks, Joe really does love Janie despite her stubbornness and doesn’t wish for anyone else, only that she would be more appreciative and recognize the privileges he gives her.
Similar to Emma's post...
ReplyDelete“ ‘Jody, it wasn’t because Ah didn’t have no sympathy. Ah had uh lavish uh dat. Ah just didn’t never git no chance tuh use none of it. You wouldn’t let me.’
‘Dat’s right, blame everything on me. Ah wouldn’t let you show no feelin’! When, Janie, dat’s all I Ah ever wanted or desired. Now you come blamin’ me!’” (85).
I wanted to discuss Joe’s character. He is a difficult one to sympathize with because him and Janie are so different, and I am naturally inclined to be drawn to Janie’s side of matters. However, I am very intrigued by him and his intentions for Janie. He mentions that he wants her to be a “big woman” in the town, yet he is constantly suppressing her and keeping her down. Finally, on his deathbed, Janie confronts him, and he mentions that all he ever wanted was for her to be free and have the life she wanted. I believe that Joe thought that if he became powerful and successful, that would be enough for Janie. He wanted to raise her up in society, yet then keep her secluded and protected. Janie is a woman who must be active, who must be equal, and who must have a voice. When Joe was upon his deathbed, a part of me began to feel sorry for this man, who deep down was only trying to do what he thought was right. Clearly, Janie and him have very different ideas of what sympathy is, and how to show it. I think that there are many women who would have been content to live in an isolated life in luxury, yet as I previously discussed, Janie is not one for material things and seclusion, and unfortunately Joe’s intentions, which I believe were good deep down, were warped and lost on Janie. Therefore, while he may not be a bad person, him and Janie wanted very different things out of life, and their relationship ultimately could not have worked out.
In response to Emma Asano's post I agree completely. Jody restricts what Janie can do. Janie often takes this as Jody just wanting more power. However, Joe normally has a reason for what he does an example is when he makes her cover her hair in the store because he saw someone stroking it. Joe does not ever try to explain his actions to Janie and Janie never asks. This lack of communication I think is one of the reasons that their relationship has so many problems.
ReplyDeleteIn response to Devon Katz's post. I agree that Tea Cake is completely different from her previous husbands. You pointed out that he was younger than her and respected her as none of her previous husbands had. My theory on why this is that they were all so much older than her, not only is Janie a woman (and therefore inferior in many eyes) but she is also a good ten years or so older than her so anything she said could be easily discounted because of her age and her gender. However this isn't true for Tea Cake because he is younger than her.
ReplyDeleteIn response to Genevieve’s post: I agree that it is odd that she accepts everything he does to her. However, every time she tries to step out of the nice little box he has put her in he responds, not by listening to what she has to say and arguing with it but by ignoring what she says and making a joke out of it. After the quote you took for page 75 he responds by saying that she is “getting’ too moufy” and then has her get the checkerboard for him. Jody believes that he what she says has no merit because she is a woman.
ReplyDeleteIn response to Aysha's very very early post, I feel that Phoeby is one of the most important characters to the novel. Janie tells Phoeby everything and Phoeby is her guide. If Janie were not telling Phoeby her story, there would be no story. One interesting point that Aysha brought up was the fact that Phoeby serves as a bridge between Janie's two homes. I have to agree with this and add that Phoeby is the single constant thing in Janie's life; she is always there and seems like she always will be.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Misha's last post about Joe completely. He really believes that he is doing everything right by Janie. He believes that he is giving her everything she could ever want. He really does have good intentions its just that his intentions for Janie are different from the ones she has for herself. Also he is not keeping her isolated out of cruelty or malice, he just honestly thinks that he has given her what any woman would want and he is truly confused when Janie is not content.
ReplyDeleteGoing off of what Misha brought up about the women of the town being unprepared to see an independent woman, I feel almost as though the other women of the town were jealous of Janie in many ways. I think that the women wished they could be like her in that she was very independent since she was young. She's out spoken as well, and usually the women are discouraged from participating in debates and discussion. We see this when she is married to Joe; she is not allowed to speak to his "manly" friends. I know that from personal experience, I can become jealous of friends who are allowed to do something that I am not.
ReplyDeleteIn response to Misha and Erica: I completely agree Jody and Janie are very different. Janie is unhappy with the life she has but she only complains a few times in the twenty years she is married to Jody, so it could be possible that he is unaware for the majority of their marriage that that she is not content with the life that he has provided her with.
ReplyDeleteI think that Jody has a big ego, and it only gets worse throughout the book because he gets more and more authority. He starts as a young Georgian going down the road looking for a new, cool place to invest in. Along the way he meets a pretty young woman and she runs away with him. When he gets to Eatonville, he has authority because he comes up with all these ideas to make the town bigger and better: a store, a post office, a streetlamp. Then he becomes mayor, he also own the store and runs the post office. This means that he has pretty much all the authority because without him the whole town would fall apart. Because of this authority he gets used to being boss and gives Janie the same treatment as he gives everyone else, he treats her as an inferior. Being able to see how he deals with having all this power is a big insight into who Jody is, because everyone deals with power differently.
ReplyDeleteI found Logan Killicks to be an interesting character because he wasn't the direct cause of the marriage failing. He had been arranged to wed Janie, an arrangement that Janie wasn't happy with. From the outset, he was simply the husband that Janie resented, through no fault of his own. He tried to be accommodating towards Janie, but he just couldn't offer Janie what she was looking for, and this soon became apparent to both parties. Once he realized that Janie was not going to enjoy to being his wife, he became resentful that she would never warm up to him. He then decides that if they aren't going to have a successful marriage, he may as well make her do some work around the property. For Janie, this was unacceptable, and she was more than happy to run off with Jody when the opportunity presented itself. In the end, I think Logan ultimately comes off as a sympathetic character. He is promised Janie's hand in marriage, and does his best to provide for her and be a decent husband. Janie isn't happy with the arrangement, and soon leaves him for another man.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI think that the most important relationship in the novel is the one between Janie and her grandmother. Even though her grandmother dies early on in the novel, Janie is influenced by the people around her, especially her grandmother and the older women. The biggest influence Janie experienced was the way she learned how to interpret love. Love is a confusing emotion, and there are many factors that were taken into consideration while Janie contemplated whether or not she will love her first husband. In all Janie is a very confused woman who's emotions seem to drive her quest for love, unlike most women in the novel who perfer to simply go with the richer and more wealthy man. -Ari
ReplyDelete“‘Looka heah, Tea Cake, if you ever go off from me and have a good time lak dat and then come back heah tellin’ me how nice Ah is, Ah specks tah kill yuh dead. You heah me?’
ReplyDelete‘So you aims tuh partake wid everything, hunh?’
‘Yeah, Tea Cake, don’t keer what it is.’
‘Dat’s all Ah wants tuh know. From now on you’se mah wife and mah woman and everything else in de world Ah needs.’
‘Ah hope so.’” (124).
One aspect of Janie’s personality that surprised and delighted me was that she did not get mad at Tea Cake that day he stole the two hundred dollars from her. After he is done describing the excursion, the only anger that arises is that fact that he did not bring her with him. It’s a very endearing anger too, for it shows how much she truly cares about him, and just him. She lost nearly 180 dollars, yet she is willing to sacrifice it to have Tea Cake back. Knowing that she has his love and his loyalty is enough to forgive the spending spree. This brings up another aspect of Janie’s personality. She is unlike most people at that time, and money is not a priority in her life. She would much prefer love. Love has always been a fascination of Janie’s, and after waiting many years for it to come, she had finally found it. I think this it a very dignified stance that Janie takes, and a very admirable one. She has a clear understanding of what she wants, and she is willing to commit to her values. Her respect and appreciation of love over money make her character much more relatable.
I agree with Ari that Janie and her grandmother was the most important. Even though Janie didn't agree with her, she still thought of her advice before making decisions about love.
ReplyDeleteI've noticed a lot of talk about Nanny. I've also noticed that Nanny reappears several times during the story as an example for Janie and an explanation for several of her ideas of what she wanted and didn't want. At first she seems unimportant, but if you pay attention she is very important.
ReplyDeleteI noticed that Janie's mother was raped at age seventeen and Janie was married at age seventeen. I wonder if this detail is pertinent or means nothing.
ReplyDeleteI feel as though when Tea Cake comes into Janie's life, it is time for her to let go of her past. She talks about her Nanny's wishes for her to "sit on the high chair", and how she has fulfilled these wishes. Janie feels that it is now time to movie on, and live her own life. Tea Cake has prepared her for this transition, and helped her realize that she has a whole lot of her life to keep living. Tea Cake is a vital character in the novel, mostly for Janie's sake. Without him, she would be trapped living her grandmother's boring life, that she obviously was not put on the planet to live.
ReplyDeleteTo add on to Sally's comment, it seemed to me that Janie was opening up for the first time, both to herself and to Tea Cake, about her past and her childhood. Tea Cake gives her the confidence to really deeply look at both the good and the bad in everyone she has loved, honestly. She recognizes a hidden hatred of Nanny, and then lets it go. Before Tea Cake, she was clinging to her image of her grandmother, too afraid that if she let herself shatter it, there would be no one she could truly love and look up to. Once Tea Cake comes into her life, she knows she has at least him, and she can be completely honest with herself about everyone else.
ReplyDeleteI completely agree with Sally and Alicia. Tea Cake really gave Janie the confidence that she really needed to become her own person and leave behind the woman that she had been molded into by her grandmother and her first two husbands. She is finally able to be herself without being held back by the people of her past. I agree with Alicia's statement that Tea Cake allowed her to be honest with herself. With him she could be whoever she wanted and not just the person that others wanted her to be. The more I think about it the more I realize that Tea Cake really empowered her.
ReplyDeleteWhen I'd first started the novel, I wrote a response about Janie Crawford. Now that I've finished reading the book, I thought I'd write another response about my new perspective on her.
ReplyDeleteAt the start of the novel, Janie was living a life that was put there for her by her Grandmother. She went along with it, as loyalty is one of her many great traits. As she progresses forward, she realizes that the life she is pursuing is not for her. Janie shows her stubborn, strong willed side. When she leaves her first husband, she is simply looking for security, trying to figure out herself as much as she can. She struggles with realizing that she doesn't have the common sense she should have been taught as a child. She doesn't have the skills to make her own proper decisions, so she looks to other people to make them for her. Janie pounds through life without ever taking time to enjoy it. She's too caught up in constant drama with other people putting her down. Near the end of the book though, Janie finds her place in the world. She meets new and raw people, who make her feel at home. She is content with her place in society, especially the fact that she's no longer on the high chair. In fact, she's working in the fields with the rest of the common people. Janie is a realist. She knows just where she fits in the world, and she's not trying to fool anyone by being someone she's not. Eventually, Janie proves everyone wrong. She does what every woman of her time see's as impossible; she lives her life to the absolute fullest. So in the end, it's apparent that Janie Crawford is a very strong willed woman.
I agree with Ari. Janie's grandmother is one of the most vital characters in the novel. Without her, Janie would have a totally different view on love. The one she has is very complicated, as Janie was never taught what to believe. Unlike the other women of her time, Janie learns fast that love isn't all about wealth and class. It's about pure happiness, which she later accomplishes with her third and final husband.
ReplyDeleteJanie, epitomizes the unique struggles of Black women during the Post Reconstruction period, and embarks on a journey of self-discovery to achieve independence and self-understanding. Yet she does not attain this until she is nearly forty years old. A myriad of obstacles stand in her way throughout her adolescence and young adulthood, the first of which is her grandmother, who encourages her to marry Logan Killicks for material security. But Janie discovers that 'marriage did not make love,' (pg. 25) and she decides to leave him, the first pin point of independence and self-actualization in her life. When Joe Starks enters her life, she believes she has found her ticket to the 'horizon,' so she marries him, representing her continued search for both true love and her own freedom. Stifled by Jody’s pride and cut off from the rest of the community by her status as the mayor's wife, she learns to hide her real self and wear a mask for Jody and the town that conforms to their expectations for her. But in the process she loses sight of the real self she has buried
ReplyDelete-Jacob
Continued...
ReplyDeleteThe narrator tells us, 'She had an inside and an outside now and suddenly she knew not how to mix them.' (pg. 47) This polarization of her psyche decays the true Janie and provides an internal quagmire for her journey of self-determination. This aspect of Janie’s character imparts the all important fact that freedom must not only be had, but expressed for it to have any worth. After twenty years of marriage, the enmity between Janie and her husband reaches a tipping point when she finally speaks up for herself. As he lays on his deathbed, she sums up for him what their marriage has been like for her: 'Mah own mind had tuh be squeezed and crowded out tuh make room for yours in me.' (pg. 86). Jody’s death liberates Janie to continue on her path to discover herself without the restrictions of men or society upon her.
And last but not least.
ReplyDeleteHaving lost herself once, Janie vows not to do so again, and so she enjoys her freedom after Jody’s death. But when Tea Cake walks into her life, she finds a man who complements her search for self-awareness rather than squelches it. Under the influence of his all-encompassing love, 'her soul crawled out from its hiding place’ (pg. 105). With Tea Cake, she finds a spiritual sense of love that had been absent in her first two marriages. 'Ah wuz fumblin' round and God opened the door,' she tells him (pg. 114). Hurston's decision to make Janie discover her true self in the context of a relationship with a man seems odd at first (after all she had been rebelling against men and authority for the larger part of the novel), but the conclusion of her time with Tea Cake is telling. Janie does eventually gains true independence when she is forced to kill Tea Cake, a symbolic feminist act, yet one that is also poignant and rife with emotion. This final act, although it devastates Janie, also allows her to return home to Eatonville a fully self-sufficient woman who is finally at peace with herself. 'Ah done been tuh de horizon and back and now Ah kin set heah in mah house and live by comparisons,' she tells her friend Pheoby (pg. 191). Her journey of self-discovery is complete.
In response to Ami's post:
ReplyDeleteWhile I agree that Phoebe is an important character, I think it is important to realise that this almost entirely due to the fact that she is the lens through which us, the reader, experiences the plot.
Janie seems to be an extremely trusting person, even to a very unreasonable extent. She has complete trust in the elders telling her that she will eventually love Logan Killicks after she has married him. She takes there word, marries him, and ends up completely regretting it.
ReplyDeleteShe then runs off with Joe Starks, simply off of his word that he would treat her better than Logan treated her. This promise seems to degrade fast. His good treatment of woman is ased completely off of sexist ideals. Once again, her trusting nature has hurt her.
Janie in general seems very idealistic. First Logan makes her do things she doesn’t want to do, and then Joe doesn’t let her do things she wants to do, but she can’t seem to get this perfect idea of hers of somewhere in between. It is interesting then of her reaction to Tea Cake’s flaws, of which he has many. He seems overly arrogant, has a problem with gambling, seems to take part in a few major fights which didn’t ever seem to be a problem with Joe, and lastly he seems very possessive, beating Janie just to show that she was HIS wife. Janie does not seem to have a problem with this, because there is nothing innately sexist in his shortcomings, and this seems to really be what Janie despises. She continues this trusting nature with Tea Cake, following him wherever he goes, and believing in him absolutely.
In response to Misha's post about Joe Stark:
ReplyDeleteI never really sympathized with Joe (nor do I think most readers) but you raise a very good point that all Joe could really want is the best possible environment for Janie. The entire novel is so Janie-biased that it is impossible to tell when theJanie ends and the Narrator begins. This is particularly evident when the novel begins to describe Joe as a fat, sad, sick old wife beater. And while his acts eventually become reprehensible (this could be an emotional tantrum at the fact that his wife see's him as so despicable), we cannot be so sure that Janie is completely being honest with her account of their time together.
Joe:
ReplyDeleteJoe's character is an egotistical one. he never says anything bad about himself, and will not tolerate others talking badly about him.
he has a mind for money and it's flow, and uses this to make a very successful store.
he is also great at manipulating people, using them to boost himself higher in the town hierarchy. not only does he posses these skills, but he is also clever enough to be able to use them well. he skillfully entered the town of Eatonville with $300, but when he dies, he had (according to Janie) at least $10,000. however, eventually he loses the image of himself that he thought to preserve. in order to stop it decaying, he constantly throws attention at even the smallest of Janie's slip-ups. he refuses to see his current self, and his death is caused by him overestimating the strength of his body.
Michael,
ReplyDeleteI don't think he's as egotistical as he is self-conscious. He is in a position of power, and that can put an immense burden on someone. The reason he never says anything bad about himself(by the way, pretty much nobody in this novel says anything bad about themselves) is because he doesn't want people to hear that he is not quite as sure of himself as he may want them to believe.
Janie:
ReplyDeleteA theme for Janie throughout all of Their Eyes Were Watching God was finding true love, the right man for her. This inner conflict, to me, resolved itself slowly and nicely throughout the novel.
First, Janie was involuntarily paired with Logan Killicks as her first husband, due to the wishes of her grandmother. Janie had no feelings for Logan, she knew that they had no connection or similarities.
Secondly, Janie left Logan for Joe Starks. I sincerely believe that in the beginning of Janie and Joe's relationship, Joe was truly a good man with good intentions. Janie found out the tough way that he was easily changed when given authority and power.
Through these experiences Janie was changed negatively. If she had a truly healthy, loving relationship with a husband, she would not have to feel a renewed sense of freedom after they died (Joe Starks), or after she left them (Logan Killicks).
Janie's indescribable feelings toward Teacake are why they were such a good fit. She wasn't looking for someone rich who could support her, or someone famous to give her a name. She liked Teacake plainly for who he was, he wasn't popular and nor did he have a significant amount of money, which is what in my eyes made their relationship special and real, thus resolving Janie's inner conflict of finding true love.